IRFCA Mailing List Archive

Messages 2161 - 2180

From: Sankar <shankie@emirates.email

Subject: Accommodation on the Palace on Wheels train

Date: 07 Feb 1998 06:51:00 -0500

A few weeks ago,one of our members had enquired about the type of
accommodation available on the Palace on Wheels train. I'd hoped to
reply that very same day,but unfortunately my computer was on the
blink:its been fixed only today.I hope I'mnot too late,and that gentleman
hasn't left already.
I guess 3-in-a-cabin is OK.
I have here a tourist brochure from the Indian Tourist Development Corp.
(ITDC) which gives rates for single occupance, double occupancy and
triple occupancy.
Incidentally, I hope my friend is aware that the Palace on wheels no
longer consists of the old re-furbished carriages royale.Those cars have
been taken off the rails,having been certified as too old to keep on
running.
The entire P on W route has been regauged to broad gauge as well.The
original p on w rake is now at the National Rail Museum,Delhi,and is
awaiting conversion to a luxury hotel.
The spanking new broad gauge air conditioned p on w, put on line in 1992 or
so (I'm not dead certain of the year) is actually a 5-star luxury hotel on
rails,
and is diesel hauled.All the cars are brand new.
The circuit is:DELHI-JAIPUR-CHITTORGARH-UDAIPUR-SAWAI MADHOPUR-JAISALMER-
JODHPUR-BHARATPUR-AGRA-DELHI.(Covering Delhi-UP(Agra)-Rajasthan)

There is another P-on-w like train, called the Royal Orient:it is on the
meter gauge. At least it was till last year.This is steam hauled,though I
do not think for the entire route.This train also uses new cars.
The route is DELHI-UDAIPUR-PALITANA-SOMNATH-AHMEDPUR MANDVI-SASAN GIR-
AHMEDABAD-JAIPUR-DELHI (COVERING Delhi-Rajasthan,UP and Gujarat).

The Royal Orient is more explicit in specifying the type of accommodation
provided:Two-berth cabin,Single accommodation (sharing basis) and
three-berth cabin(two lower + one upper).

Foreign nationals are to pay in USD only.

Please forward to the concerned person:I'm sorry I lost all data for one
whole week before my computer went kaput.

Best regards.
Shankar.

From: shankar s. <shankaronline@mailexcite.email

Subject: Don dickens monorail page

Date: 07 Feb 1998 07:04:00 -0500

Could you help me re-locate Don Dickens's patiala state
monorail trainways homepage?
I'd bookmarked it,but lost it when my system went kaput
due to which the whole thing had to be downloaded and
reloaded.
I tried to e-mail Don directly on e-z net,in,but it
obviously isn't the correct address:it keeps coming
back with 'fatal errors'.
Thank you for your help.
Shankar:Shankie@emirates.email

Free web-based email, Forever, From anywhere!
<A HREF="http://www.mailexcite.com">http://www.mailexcite.com</A>

From: Sankar <shankie@emirates.email

Subject: Re: Accommodation on the Palace on Wheels train

Date: 08 Feb 1998 05:53:00 -0500

The Palace on Wheels had a spanking new broad gauge commisioned in
(or about) 1992.
The Royal Orient does not use brand new cars,but cars of a comparatively
recent origin.I know for a fact that it no longer uses the old P on W
cars because I saw these very cars in an advanced state of disinte-
gration at the National Rail Musuem when I visited in Nov.1997.An official
there assured me that these are indeed the P on W cars,now bought by a
private party,and due to be converted into a luxury hotel.Sort of reminded
me of the old train cars hotel at Chatanooga,USA.I saw it in a film,the
hotel is called the Choo choo Hilton Hotel or something.
Maybe the locomotive is the same P on W one: the DESERT QUEEN.
However,as you say that you saw these cars on the train last year,either
they have since been de-commissioned (I read that they have been),or
maybe a couple of cars are still sticking around, living on borrowed time.

I agree with you wholeheartedly about the pricing bit.Leave alone foreign
nationals, even Indians living abroad (Non Resident Indians) are not
spared, when it comes to ripping off.It starts right from the customs
official,taxi driver, porter, everywhere.

Probably how the premium pricing started was the steam traction offered
on the train.In the mid 1980s, India was one of the very few countries
which still had steam engines left.It was probably hoped that steam freaks,
be they foreigners or Indians living abroad,will be willing to pay a hefty
price for the thrill of traveling in a steam hauled train just like the
erstwhile maharajas,in the very cars the maharajas used.

Now that India has joined the bandwagon of countries shamelessly
doing away with steam, lock stock and barrel,at one go,and with the old
veteran cars duly retired, both the USPs are no longer there.The stress
now is on luxury.But you're right.There is no justification to charge
such a high price any more.

The same stunt must have been pulled with the Fairy Queen as well.With over
90% of the steamers now having disappeared,its all the more reason to charge
a hefty price.If you want to see it and experience it,you gotta pay
for it!

Clearly,the IR is getting a taste of its own medicine.Lack of info means
those blokes in charge of pricing probably don't know of the hundreds of
preserved steam railways worldwide.Even rail freaks like us know they
exist,but don't know details of too many of them!

The problem is, when a scheme like this bombs,rather than make amends,it
will be shelved as 'unworkable'.

Best regards.

Shankar.

At 09:39 AM 2/7/98 +0100, you wrote:
>Are you sure that the Royal Orient has brand new cars, too? As far as I
know the
>Royal Orient uses the cars formerly used by the Palace on Wheels. At least
this
>is what we experienced a year ago.
>
>Both trains atcually are not really well selling. Few dates are fully booked,
>most others suffer from lack of tourists. One of the main problems from the
>point of a tour operator is the pricing polidy. They do not grant anough
>commission to travel agents and tour operators and their prices for full
>charters are horrible.
>
>It seems that they make the same mistake as Indian Railways with the "Fairy
>Queens" tours: They think foreigners are rich and are prepared to pay any
price,
>but they forget their trains are in competition with a lot of other one's
around
>the world. The 2-day "Fairy Queens" tours first were offered at 400,-- USD per
>person, now they had to reduce it to 1/3 of that - and it is not worth any
>additional penny.
>
>Does anyone have contacts to the officials doing such stupid pricing policies?
>
>Helmut
>7.2.98
>------------------
>
>Sankar wrote:
>A few weeks ago,one of our members had enquired about the type of
>accommodation available on the Palace on Wheels train. I'd hoped to
>reply that very same day,but unfortunately my computer was on the
>blink:its been fixed only today.I hope I'mnot too late,and that gentleman
>hasn't left already.
>I guess 3-in-a-cabin is OK.
>I have here a tourist brochure from the Indian Tourist Development Corp.
>(ITDC) which gives rates for single occupance, double occupancy and
>triple occupancy.
>Incidentally, I hope my friend is aware that the Palace on wheels no
>longer consists of the old re-furbished carriages royale.Those cars have
>been taken off the rails,having been certified as too old to keep on
>running.
>The entire P on W route has been regauged to broad gauge as well.The
>original p on w rake is now at the National Rail Museum,Delhi,and is
>awaiting conversion to a luxury hotel.
>The spanking new broad gauge air conditioned p on w, put on line in 1992 or
>so (I'm not dead certain of the year) is actually a 5-star luxury hotel on
>rails,
>and is diesel hauled.All the cars are brand new.
>The circuit is:DELHI-JAIPUR-CHITTORGARH-UDAIPUR-SAWAI MADHOPUR-JAISALMER-
>JODHPUR-BHARATPUR-AGRA-DELHI.(Covering Delhi-UP(Agra)-Rajasthan)
>
>There is another P-on-w like train, called the Royal Orient:it is on the
>meter gauge. At least it was till last year.This is steam hauled,though I
>do not think for the entire route.This train also uses new cars.
>The route is DELHI-UDAIPUR-PALITANA-SOMNATH-AHMEDPUR MANDVI-SASAN GIR-
>AHMEDABAD-JAIPUR-DELHI (COVERING Delhi-Rajasthan,UP and Gujarat).
>
>The Royal Orient is more explicit in specifying the type of accommodation
>provided:Two-berth cabin,Single accommodation (sharing basis) and
>three-berth cabin(two lower + one upper).
>
>Foreign nationals are to pay in USD only.
>
>Please forward to the concerned person:I'm sorry I lost all data for one
>whole week before my computer went kaput.
>
>Best regards.
>Shankar.
>-------------------
>
>Helmut Mochel
>Rail Tours Mochel Reisen
>Postfach 48, 77922 Lahr, Germany
>Phone +49 7821 43037, Fax +49 7821 42998
>
>
>

From: Prakash Tendulkar <prakash@jps.email

Subject: Konkan on the fast track

Date: 07 Feb 1998 06:13:00 -0500

Indian Express
Feb 7, 1998

Konkan on the fast track

As the Karwar-bound diesel multiple unit (DMU) train leaves
Ratnagiri station early in the morning, the villages along the
tracks begin to come to life.

On January 26, the coastal belt of Western India woke up to
realise that what it thought was a dream was, in fact, the
reality. The 760-km railway line now does not have any missing
link. The Konkan Railways, a dream project of the entire Western
India, was finally ready for the people. As he watches the
progress of the wheels of development in his native land, a 42-
year-old passenger begins to carve out his own little dream in the
explosion of development that is expected to hit Konkan.

Suddenly darkness descends as the train enters one of the many
tunnels. Silence grips the compartment, bringing with it a grim
reminder of lives lost while digging the underbelly of
themountains. About 65 engineers and labourers have laid down
their lives digging tunnels and erecting bridges.

But the project rolled on, throwing up new opportunities and
challenges for the people of Konkan, now waiting for the big bucks
-- thousands of crores of expected investment.

Copyright c 1998 Indian Express Newspapers (Bombay) Ltd.
======================

From: sank <sank@telco.email

Subject: Re: Accommodation on the Palace on Wheels train

Date: 08 Feb 1998 18:18:00 -0500

> Maybe the locomotive is the same P on W one: the DESERT QUEEN.

Don't think so: the Desert Queen was a YP type, but the loco standingwith the
P&W rake in Delhi is apparently an older British type (I couldn't
get close enough to find out).

> Now that India has joined the bandwagon of countries shamelessly
> doing away with steam, lock stock and barrel,at one go,and with the old
> veteran cars duly retired, both the USPs are no longer there.The stress
> now is on luxury.But you're right.There is no justification to charge
> such a high price any more.
>
> Clearly,the IR is getting a taste of its own medicine.Lack of info means
> those blokes in charge of pricing probably don't know of the hundreds of
> preserved steam railways worldwide.Even rail freaks like us know they
> exist,but don't know details of too many of them!

As I have always wondered, is there no way to help guide a preservationprogram for
IR ? As far as I know, most preserved railways in the rest of
the world aren't priced out of reach of most people. I wonder how much
it really costs to keep a steam locomotive running in India on preserved
runs, considering our indigenous coal and manpower resources. I suppose
some bureaucrats in Rail Bhavan are more interested in foreign exchange
earning than the preservation of Indian industrial heritage.......

--
Jayant S*ID Studio*TTIL*TELCO
Pimpri*Pune 411 018*INDIA*tel:91-212-774261 exn 2534
Email me at "sank@telco.email. Do NOT use your "reply" button !

From: Sankar <shankie@emirates.email

Subject: Re: Accommodation on the Palace on Wheels train

Date: 09 Feb 1998 07:39:00 -0500

Sorry Sank, despite your warning, I HAVE to use the reply button,for
otherwise,the link will be lost,and no one will appreciate what exactly
I'm talking about!
When I said that the engine is probably the same as the P on W one,I
meant the engine of the Royal Orient.
The tiny engine at the head of the condemned P on W rake at the National
Rail Museum couldn't possibly have hauled that many cars over such a
long distance!
The tiny loco at the head of the old P on W rake at the NRM is a 1942
built 0-6-0PT, class TJ.Considered the second lightest mg engine built,
the TJ was used on the Jaipur Railway for branch line & light train
workings, and for shunting.
The engine is reportedly still is working condition,and at least one release
from the NRM said that she steams occasionally within the musuem grounds,
shunting exhibits (re-locating them) whenever necessary.
The story the supervisor at the NRM gave me when I visited in Nov.1997 was
that while the private party had purchased the rake,he felt it was incomplete
without an engine,and requested the NRM for one.
The NRM obliged,and put the TJ at the head of the rake.
Now whether the chap has purchased th TJ as well outright, or the NRM only
decided to re-locate the TJ there,while retaining ownership I do not know,
nor was the supervisor able to tell me.
As regards the second half of the message, I agree wholeheartedly.
Best regards.
Shankar.

At 08:48 AM 2/8/98 +0530, you wrote:
>
>
>> Maybe the locomotive is the same P on W one: the DESERT QUEEN.
>
>Don't think so: the Desert Queen was a YP type, but the loco standingwith the
>P&W rake in Delhi is apparently an older British type (I couldn't
>get close enough to find out).
>
>> Now that India has joined the bandwagon of countries shamelessly
>> doing away with steam, lock stock and barrel,at one go,and with the old
>> veteran cars duly retired, both the USPs are no longer there.The stress
>> now is on luxury.But you're right.There is no justification to charge
>> such a high price any more.
>>
>> Clearly,the IR is getting a taste of its own medicine.Lack of info means
>> those blokes in charge of pricing probably don't know of the hundreds of
>> preserved steam railways worldwide.Even rail freaks like us know they
>> exist,but don't know details of too many of them!
>
>As I have always wondered, is there no way to help guide a
preservationprogram for
>IR ? As far as I know, most preserved railways in the rest of
>the world aren't priced out of reach of most people. I wonder how much
>it really costs to keep a steam locomotive running in India on preserved
>runs, considering our indigenous coal and manpower resources. I suppose
>some bureaucrats in Rail Bhavan are more interested in foreign exchange
>earning than the preservation of Indian industrial heritage.......
>
>
>--
>Jayant S*ID Studio*TTIL*TELCO
>Pimpri*Pune 411 018*INDIA*tel:91-212-774261 exn 2534
>Email me at "sank@telco.email. Do NOT use your "reply" button !
>
>
><HTML>
> 
><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>Maybe the locomotive is the same P on W one: the
>DESERT QUEEN.</BLOCKQUOTE>
>Don't think so: the Desert Queen was a YP type, but the loco
>standingwith the P&W rake in Delhi is apparently an older British
>type (I couldn't
> get close enough to find out).
><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>Now that India has joined the bandwagon of countries
>shamelessly
> doing away with steam, lock stock and barrel,at one go,and with the
>old
> veteran cars duly retired, both the USPs are no longer there.The stress
> now is on luxury.But you're right.There is no justification to charge
> such a high price any more. 
>
>Clearly,the IR is getting a taste of its own medicine.Lack of info means
> those blokes in charge of pricing probably don't know of the hundreds
>of
> preserved steam railways worldwide.Even rail freaks like us know they
> exist,but don't know details of too many of them!</BLOCKQUOTE>
>As I have always wondered, is there no way to help guide a preservationprogram
>for IR ? As far as I know, most preserved railways in the rest
>of
> the world aren't priced out of reach of most people. I wonder how much
> it really costs to keep a steam locomotive running in India on preserved
> runs, considering our indigenous coal and manpower resources. I suppose
> some bureaucrats in Rail Bhavan are more interested in foreign exchange
> earning than the preservation of Indian industrial heritage.......
>  
><PRE>--
>Jayant S*ID Studio*TTIL*TELCO   
>Pimpri*Pune 411 018*INDIA*tel:91-212-774261 exn 2534
>Email me at "sank@telco.email. Do NOT use your "reply" button !</PRE>
> </HTML>
>

From: Sankar <shankie@emirates.email

Subject: Re: Gwalior/Scindia Baldwins

Date: 09 Feb 1998 07:39:00 -0500

Hello David,
Rescuing a couple of Baldwins from the cutting torch:you have embarked upon
a very noble cause indeed.Hats off to you. My best wishes and prayers will be
with you always.
But you must be prepared to brave many odds.Please note,at this moment,I'm
ONLY BRAINSTORMING.Other members might have better ideas,especially those
who live in India:I'm presently located in Dubai.But let me put forth my
views on the subject:there are some things you must be informed/forewarned
about:
1.The Indian Railways do not usually "store" locomotives per se,except under
very special circumstances.However,with the elimination of steam program,they
have been taking pride in announcing that x number of steam sheds have been
closed down.i.e.,eliminating steam and closing down the sheds is usually done
side by side.So if the old veterans are withdrawn,chances are,they will not
be officialy stored at all,for their sheds will be gone too.
2.Even if you do locate a stored engine,the Railways are not allowed to sell
to a private party except through public auction or by inviting tenders.
3.In your case,you intend moving the engines out of India.That complicates
matters even more:govt.involvement is imminent,clearances etc.
4.The Financial Commissioner, Railways is usually the chap who handles such
cases:imports,exports etc.One of my relatives was one,nearly five years ago.
Your first worry is to LOCATE the engine,it she exists.You then need to write
to the Financial Commissioner.
5.You might think why I'm jumping to that step before even locating the engine.
It might be worthwhile to put up your proposal to this man before you move any
further.Now,the indian bureaucracy is designed to frustrate even the most det-
ermined Hindu saint,and these GOvt.officials have this nasty habit of either not
replying or giving typically bureacratic one liners,but there is also a chance
that he might tell you something useful.They may even tell you don't waste your
time, such and such has happened to the engines already etc.
Try writing to:The Financial Commissioner,Railways
OR The Secretary,Railway Board,both of whom are located at:
Rail Bhavan, New Delhi 110 001.
These are the ultimate authority if you intend taking any rail item out of the
country,so it makes sense to begin at the very top.
6.It might help a great deal if you approach the local Indian Consulate or
Embassy in your country.They will at least put you on the right track.If you
try things out on your own,you might end up being flabbergasted or frustrated.
7.Although Gwalior is bang in the center of India,on the main Bombay-Delhi line,
its actually an obscure little town,with little or no industrialization.Hence
people with links in that place will be difficult to come by.
8.Now this is a long shot:it may not even be feasible:Mr.Madhavrao Scindia,a
one time previous railway minister,and now member or parliament,hails from
Gwalior,and is a direct descendant of the Gwalior Royal family.He has a lot of
clout in that area,and is regarded as a Maharaja himself.The local Consulate or
embassy of India might have ideas as to how to contact him or his secretary.
He is bound to know something,as its HIS territory.With his royalty background,
he is supposed to be receptive to foreigners,and not pig headed like most other
politicians in India.
Chew on this,and lets see where we can go from here on.
Best regards.
Shankar.

At 10:31 PM 1/27/98 -0600, you wrote:
>Shankar, I am offering a reward of $500 US dollars to the person or persons
>that help me with information that helps me to locate, purchase and ship
>each 2' gauge Baldwin 2-8-2 the ran on the Gwalior Light Railway/Scindia
>State Railway. I will split the money if more than one person helps me so
>don't be afraid to forward. I will keep all emails, letters etc.. so that
>I can pay everyone. There were 4 of these locomotives, so that could be
>$2000 US Dollars. I will also pay the smae $500 for the Mysor Iron & Steel
>Works #10. It was identicle to the Scindia 2-8-2 Baldwins. Tell your
>friends and lets hurry.
>
>
>

From: poras p.saklatwalla <pps@godrejnet.email

Subject: Re: Konkan Rly finally gets on tracks

Date: 11 Feb 1998 23:58:00 -0500

On Sat, 24 Jan 1998, Prakash Tendulkar wrote:

> Konkan Rly finally gets on tracks
> EXPRESS NEWS SERVICE
>
> MUMBAI, January 24: The massive Konkan Railway link cutting across
> the Western Coast is finally complete with the total project cost
> mounting to Rs 3,370-cr, a considerably high debt servicing burden
> and even higher expectation of future profitability.
>
> After too many hiccups, Konkan Railway engineers removed the last
> hurdle by completing the Pernem tunnel in North Goa opening up the
> 760-km-long rail link between Roha and Mangalore. On January 26, a
> DMU train would wind its way between Ratnagiri in Maharashtra and
> Karwar in Karnataka.
>
> The ambitious project undertaken on Build Operate and Transfer
> (BOT) basis now enters the second and crucial phase of operation.
> The operating phase begins with about Rs 210-cr debt servicing
> burden and a challenge of raising working capital till the time
> Konkan Railway Corporation begins to break even.
>
> The whole project cost was initially estimated at around Rs 1042-
> cr but delays and topographical difficulties effected the
> Corporation spending Rs 3370-cr and the debt/equity ratio has
> exceeded 4:1. Now the corporation would need to generate about Rs
> 300-cr every year to run its operations.
>
> According to KRC's managing director B Rajaram, the corporation
> would have to raise funds through short term loans from financial
> institutions to bridge the revenue-outflow gap. As per today's
> projections, the Corporation would be generating Rs 25 to 30 lakh
> per day through passenger traffic and about Rs 90 lakh a day from
> diverted freight traffic. The Corporation is expected to break
> even in two years time, Rajaram said.
>
> The Konkan railway is merely a corridor to take traffic diverted
> from the existing long route on the South Central Railway. Yet
> another problem that the KRC may face is the availability of
> rolling stock. The Corporation does not have a rolling stock of
> its own. It would have to depend on the Ministry of Railways to
> procure wagons on lease. The zonal railways have been finding it
> tough to get wagons in time.
>
> However, according to Rajaram, the Konkan Railway would contribute
> towards easing the wagon shortage as the corridor promises to
> reduce the travelling time between North and South. For passenger
> traffic the KRC has promising future plans. At present five trains
> are running between various stations on the Konkan route. In
> addition, Mumbai-Managalore/Kochi Netravati Express,
> Rajkot/Gandhidham-Kochi/Trivandram Express, New Delhi Mangalore/
> Kochi Mangala Express and Hazarat Nizammudin-Trivandram Rajdhani
> would be diverted on the Konkan route. Besides, Mumbai-Goa
> Shatabdi Express would also start once the trials are completed.
>

P.P.SAKLATWALLA.
EXTN :4226/4232/4237

On the trains to be diverted to KR the Trivandrum Delhi Rajdhani will have
to come alll the way to Diva and then proceed on KR to Trivandrum ? what
time will it save at all ? Else what is the alternative route. Imagine
the Mumbai - Madgaon Shatabdi at high speed on KR and if it is Double
headed with WDM it will be a real beauty and experience to travel !
Will a Delhi _ Goa Rajdhani also start operations, soon ? What happens to
the Goa express currently on the line between NDLS AND MADGAON VIA PUNE
AND MIRAJ. Has the Miraj route been made into a Broad Gauge ? will trains
to Bangalore and Goa run on that route also. Can some one furnish me more
details about this route. Are meter guage trains still run on steam
engines near Dharwar/ Hubli.?

This route to Goa is really picturesque and will be missed by most
travellers to Goa by train like me. I was really fond of this route and
travelled frequently to Goa and Bangalore on this route,seeing a lot of
Black Beauties on the way. Please get back to me as soon as someone has
some information.

Poras Saklatwalla

From: Auroprem Kandaswami <kandaswa@apple.email

Subject: Re: Konkan Rly finally gets on tracks

Date: 11 Feb 1998 04:00:00 -0500

Poras,

The entire Miraj-Belgaum-Hubli-Davangere-Arsikere-Bangalore Section
(formerly Southern Railway, now being transferred to the new
South-Western Railway) has been converted from M.G. to B.G. This
happenned sometime in 1993/94. I think all the Steams ("Black Beauties")
on this route are now gone. In fact, IR started a new Mumbai-Bangalore
Express (via Pune, Satara, Miraj, Hubli) 1017 Dn/1018 Up on this newly
converted B.G. track. I found the timings very odd, at least for the
Down Train. It leaves Mumbai at around 22 Hours and reaches Bangalore the
third day morning in very early hours (around 04:00). I wonder if
someone
travelling from Mumbai to Bangalore will ever prefer this train in place
of
the other established Udyan or Kurla-Bangalore Expresses (via Wadi,
Guntakal).

Anyway to answer your main question - Yes, the entire Miraj-Bangalore
section is now up and running on B.G.
M.G. has become extinct on this beautiful route taking you through the
cooler
and more tranquil parts of interior Karnataka

- Auro

>On Sat, 24 Jan 1998, Prakash Tendulkar wrote:
>
>> Konkan Rly finally gets on tracks
>> EXPRESS NEWS SERVICE
>>
>> MUMBAI, January 24: The massive Konkan Railway link cutting across
>> the Western Coast is finally complete with the total project cost
>> mounting to Rs 3,370-cr, a considerably high debt servicing burden
>> and even higher expectation of future profitability.
>>
>> After too many hiccups, Konkan Railway engineers removed the last
>> hurdle by completing the Pernem tunnel in North Goa opening up the
>> 760-km-long rail link between Roha and Mangalore. On January 26, a
>> DMU train would wind its way between Ratnagiri in Maharashtra and
>> Karwar in Karnataka.
>>
>> The ambitious project undertaken on Build Operate and Transfer
>> (BOT) basis now enters the second and crucial phase of operation.
>> The operating phase begins with about Rs 210-cr debt servicing
>> burden and a challenge of raising working capital till the time
>> Konkan Railway Corporation begins to break even.
>>
>> The whole project cost was initially estimated at around Rs 1042-
>> cr but delays and topographical difficulties effected the
>> Corporation spending Rs 3370-cr and the debt/equity ratio has
>> exceeded 4:1. Now the corporation would need to generate about Rs
>> 300-cr every year to run its operations.
>>
>> According to KRC's managing director B Rajaram, the corporation
>> would have to raise funds through short term loans from financial
>> institutions to bridge the revenue-outflow gap. As per today's
>> projections, the Corporation would be generating Rs 25 to 30 lakh
>> per day through passenger traffic and about Rs 90 lakh a day from
>> diverted freight traffic. The Corporation is expected to break
>> even in two years time, Rajaram said.
>>
>> The Konkan railway is merely a corridor to take traffic diverted
>> from the existing long route on the South Central Railway. Yet
>> another problem that the KRC may face is the availability of
>> rolling stock. The Corporation does not have a rolling stock of
>> its own. It would have to depend on the Ministry of Railways to
>> procure wagons on lease. The zonal railways have been finding it
>> tough to get wagons in time.
>>
>> However, according to Rajaram, the Konkan Railway would contribute
>> towards easing the wagon shortage as the corridor promises to
>> reduce the travelling time between North and South. For passenger
>> traffic the KRC has promising future plans. At present five trains
>> are running between various stations on the Konkan route. In
>> addition, Mumbai-Managalore/Kochi Netravati Express,
>> Rajkot/Gandhidham-Kochi/Trivandram Express, New Delhi Mangalore/
>> Kochi Mangala Express and Hazarat Nizammudin-Trivandram Rajdhani
>> would be diverted on the Konkan route. Besides, Mumbai-Goa
>> Shatabdi Express would also start once the trials are completed.
>>
>
>P.P.SAKLATWALLA.
>EXTN :4226/4232/4237
>
>On the trains to be diverted to KR the Trivandrum Delhi Rajdhani will have
>to come alll the way to Diva and then proceed on KR to Trivandrum ? what
>time will it save at all ? Else what is the alternative route. Imagine
>the Mumbai - Madgaon Shatabdi at high speed on KR and if it is Double
>headed with WDM it will be a real beauty and experience to travel !
>Will a Delhi _ Goa Rajdhani also start operations, soon ? What happens to
>the Goa express currently on the line between NDLS AND MADGAON VIA PUNE
>AND MIRAJ. Has the Miraj route been made into a Broad Gauge ? will trains
>to Bangalore and Goa run on that route also. Can some one furnish me more
>details about this route. Are meter guage trains still run on steam
>engines near Dharwar/ Hubli.?
>
>This route to Goa is really picturesque and will be missed by most
>travellers to Goa by train like me. I was really fond of this route and
>travelled frequently to Goa and Bangalore on this route,seeing a lot of
>Black Beauties on the way. Please get back to me as soon as someone has
>some information.
>
>
>Poras Saklatwalla
>
>

From: Vijay.Balasubramanian <Vijay.Balasubramanian@xula.email

Subject: Re: Konkan Rly finally gets on tracks

Date: 11 Feb 1998 09:24:00 -0500

> on this route are now gone. In fact, IR started a new Mumbai-Bangalore
> Express (via Pune, Satara, Miraj, Hubli) 1017 Dn/1018 Up on this newly
> converted B.G. track. I found the timings very odd, at least for the
> Down Train. It leaves Mumbai at around 22 Hours and reaches Bangalore
the
> third day morning in very early hours (around 04:00). I wonder if
>someone
> travelling from Mumbai to Bangalore will ever prefer this train in
place
>of
> the other established Udyan or Kurla-Bangalore Expresses (via Wadi,
>Guntakal).

The timings are, indeed, odd and pathetic. If it had been Delhi instead
of Mumbai, they would have started a bunch of trains to Bangalore (via
Miraj-Hubli), including a Rajdhani and another superfast. But it is
Mumbai and we have to contend with a snailer that takes nearly
29 hrs. in the Dn. direction :-( :-( (a superfast Mumbai-Hubli-
Bangalore exp. with 5-6 halts could make it in less than 21 hrs.!!!).

Vijay

From: Vijay.Balasubramanian <Vijay.Balasubramanian@xula.email

Subject: Re: Konkan Rly finally gets on tracks

Date: 11 Feb 1998 10:06:00 -0500

> On the trains to be diverted to KR the Trivandrum Delhi Rajdhani will
have
> to come alll the way to Diva and then proceed on KR to Trivandrum ?
what
> time will it save at all ? Else what is the alternative route.

Assuming that it goes via Western Rly. on Rajdhani times, it should take
about 16 1/2 hrs. from Delhi to Diva and about 24 hrs. from Diva to
Trivandrum (assuming max. speed of 100 kmph. in this stretch). So, the
total run time should be under 41 hrs. which saves nearly 5 hrs. from
the present 46 hrs. via Chennai Central. Once, the Konkan tracks are
tested for 110 kmph. or more, the run-times would be further reduced.

Imagine
> the Mumbai - Madgaon Shatabdi at high speed on KR and if it is Double
> headed with WDM it will be a real beauty and experience to travel !

Are there any steep gradients between Diva and Madgaon? It not, then
double-heading seems remote unless the Shatabdi rake has > 10 coaches.

> Will a Delhi _ Goa Rajdhani also start operations, soon ?

The Trivandrum Rajdhani should suffice, but some upstart politician from
Goa may demand a Goa Rajdhani!!!

>What happens to the Goa express currently on the line between NDLS AND
MADGAON VIA PUNE AND MIRAJ.
^^^^^^^
Vasco-da-gama

Should continue as it is. As Pushkar pointed out, the Mangala Exp. may
be re-routed via Itarsi-Bhusaval-Kalyan-Diva-Konkan Rly.

Vijay

From: Sankar <shankie@emirates.email

Subject: Re: Konkan Rly finally gets on tracks

Date: 12 Feb 1998 07:23:00 -0500

1.Which route the diverted-via-the-Konkan Railway-trains will follow: your
guess is as good as mine.
2.An interesting bit of news,there is a proposed link between Poona
(Chinchwad,to be exact) and Roha.Once this link is finished,it will be
safe to assume that trains canmeet the Konkan Railway from either end
ex-Poona:via Poona-Chinchwad-Roha, or Poona-Miraj-Madgaon.
4. You seem to be very fond of double WDM/2 headed trains,my friend.The
WDM/2s will soon go the way of steam,the way electrification is spreading
in leaps and bounds on the IR.Almost all trunk lines (except Bombay-Madras
and Howrah-Madras) are already under the wires.Of course,I say this
figuratively-don't take a literal word for word meaning!Now I don't know
when the Konkan Railway will be electrified,but you cn rest assured that
much of the route the diverted trains will take will be under the wires.So
don' hope to see too many "double WDM/2 headed" superfasts! One the KR,
maybe,for a while.
5.As two of our members have already mentioned,the Miraj-Bangalore route
has already been re-gauged to bg.There are two trains running on that route:
1017/1018 BOMBAY VT-BANGALORE EXPRESS
(Bom-Poona-Miraj-Belgaum-Hubli-Blr), and
6505/6506 BANGALORE-NIZAMUDDIN (I think) SWARNAJAYANTI EXPRESS
(Blr-Hubli-Belgaum-Miraj-Poona-Daund-Manmad-Bhusaval-
Itarsi-Gwalior-Agra-Nizamuddin (Delhi).
6.Tragic as it may sound,one has to ultimately accept the facts of life.All
those magnificent YDs and YGs and YPs of the Miraj-Goa route have bitten
the dust.
Best regards.
Shankar.

At 02:28 PM 2/11/98 +0530, you wrote:
>On Sat, 24 Jan 1998, Prakash Tendulkar wrote:
>
>> Konkan Rly finally gets on tracks
>> EXPRESS NEWS SERVICE
>>
>> MUMBAI, January 24: The massive Konkan Railway link cutting across
>> the Western Coast is finally complete with the total project cost
>> mounting to Rs 3,370-cr, a considerably high debt servicing burden
>> and even higher expectation of future profitability.
>>
>> After too many hiccups, Konkan Railway engineers removed the last
>> hurdle by completing the Pernem tunnel in North Goa opening up the
>> 760-km-long rail link between Roha and Mangalore. On January 26, a
>> DMU train would wind its way between Ratnagiri in Maharashtra and
>> Karwar in Karnataka.
>>
>> The ambitious project undertaken on Build Operate and Transfer
>> (BOT) basis now enters the second and crucial phase of operation.
>> The operating phase begins with about Rs 210-cr debt servicing
>> burden and a challenge of raising working capital till the time
>> Konkan Railway Corporation begins to break even.
>>
>> The whole project cost was initially estimated at around Rs 1042-
>> cr but delays and topographical difficulties effected the
>> Corporation spending Rs 3370-cr and the debt/equity ratio has
>> exceeded 4:1. Now the corporation would need to generate about Rs
>> 300-cr every year to run its operations.
>>
>> According to KRC's managing director B Rajaram, the corporation
>> would have to raise funds through short term loans from financial
>> institutions to bridge the revenue-outflow gap. As per today's
>> projections, the Corporation would be generating Rs 25 to 30 lakh
>> per day through passenger traffic and about Rs 90 lakh a day from
>> diverted freight traffic. The Corporation is expected to break
>> even in two years time, Rajaram said.
>>
>> The Konkan railway is merely a corridor to take traffic diverted
>> from the existing long route on the South Central Railway. Yet
>> another problem that the KRC may face is the availability of
>> rolling stock. The Corporation does not have a rolling stock of
>> its own. It would have to depend on the Ministry of Railways to
>> procure wagons on lease. The zonal railways have been finding it
>> tough to get wagons in time.
>>
>> However, according to Rajaram, the Konkan Railway would contribute
>> towards easing the wagon shortage as the corridor promises to
>> reduce the travelling time between North and South. For passenger
>> traffic the KRC has promising future plans. At present five trains
>> are running between various stations on the Konkan route. In
>> addition, Mumbai-Managalore/Kochi Netravati Express,
>> Rajkot/Gandhidham-Kochi/Trivandram Express, New Delhi Mangalore/
>> Kochi Mangala Express and Hazarat Nizammudin-Trivandram Rajdhani
>> would be diverted on the Konkan route. Besides, Mumbai-Goa
>> Shatabdi Express would also start once the trials are completed.
>>
>
>P.P.SAKLATWALLA.
>EXTN :4226/4232/4237
>
>On the trains to be diverted to KR the Trivandrum Delhi Rajdhani will have
>to come alll the way to Diva and then proceed on KR to Trivandrum ? what
>time will it save at all ? Else what is the alternative route. Imagine
>the Mumbai - Madgaon Shatabdi at high speed on KR and if it is Double
>headed with WDM it will be a real beauty and experience to travel !
>Will a Delhi _ Goa Rajdhani also start operations, soon ? What happens to
>the Goa express currently on the line between NDLS AND MADGAON VIA PUNE
>AND MIRAJ. Has the Miraj route been made into a Broad Gauge ? will trains
>to Bangalore and Goa run on that route also. Can some one furnish me more
>details about this route. Are meter guage trains still run on steam
>engines near Dharwar/ Hubli.?
>
>This route to Goa is really picturesque and will be missed by most
>travellers to Goa by train like me. I was really fond of this route and
>travelled frequently to Goa and Bangalore on this route,seeing a lot of
>Black Beauties on the way. Please get back to me as soon as someone has
>some information.
>
>
>Poras Saklatwalla
>
>
>
>

From: Sankar <shankie@emirates.email

Subject: Change in IR policy?

Date: 12 Feb 1998 07:23:00 -0500

There was a time when IR engines used to be classified as 'goods' engines
(G) (e.g. WG,YCG,WCG,WAG etc), or 'passenger' engines (P) (e.g. WP,WCP,etc).
Lets leave 'shunting' (S) and 'light passenger' (L engines for
the time being.
Then the trend was towards a whole fleet of 'mixed traffic' (M) engines:
those multipurpose machines, which were equally at home with both goods
as well as passenger traffic. (e.g. WDM, YAM, WAM, WCM etc.)
To the best of my knowledge,for the best part of the past twentyfive years,
almost every engine built in India had been of the 'M' variety,with the ONLY
TWO exceptions (to the best of my knowledge) being the WCG/2 (built
1971 or so) and the WAGs(5/5B/5HA/6A/B/C(imported)/7(home built 5000 hp).
Probably the building of goods engines continued in view of the requirement
of the heavy freight and ore carrying routes on the SER.
As I see it, the coming of the WAP engines indicated a clear reversal of
IR policy,in dedicating engines exclusively for passenger operations once
again,probably due to rapid speeding up of trains,requiring higher speeds
but not necessarily such heavy haulage capability.
Diesels are not to be outdone too. The IR Yearbook 1995-96 states that
dedicated diesels are under development too:viz WDP for passenger and WDG
for goods.Oscillation trials are in progress or something.

Two things:Can any of my friends out there help me with tracking the advent
of the WAPs? I'm now based in Dubai,and find it difficult at times to keep
abreast of developments:
WAP/1 was the first (1984):WAP/1s are still being built as far as I know.
WAP/2--?
WAP/3: Initially classed WAP/1FM II,this was changed to WAP/3:capability
of 160 kmph,but runs at only 145 due to OHE limitations.
What then are WAP/4-5-6? I saw a WAP/6 at the head of the New Delhi-Allaha-
bad Prayagraj Express (24 cars) in Nov. last year,with a ribbed body profile
and fully recessed twin headlights,she most definitely did not
appear to be built in India.
Can someone out there fill me in?

I read in the Indian Express in 1995 or so that a WAP was tested on the
New Delhi-Kanpur section for a top speed of 180 kmph.I first thought it was
a misprint,but then the same article repeated that figure again.
Any idea which WAP it was?
Best regards.
Shankar.

From: Vijay.Balasubramanian <Vijay.Balasubramanian@xula.email

Subject: Superfast Trains

Date: 11 Feb 1998 12:43:00 -0500

>
> For the record, I agree heartily with Vijay re: the dearth of
Superfast
> trains for non-Delhi cities. Mumbai has ZERO SF trains to anywhere in
> the south. Hyderabad recently got an upgrade in this respect, with
> Falaknuma and Charminar Exps becoming SF, and Chennai-Bangalore have
> good SF links - but apart from that, the situation for interlinking
> Southern cities is also pretty bad for SF exp. trains. Calcutta does
> not have SF links to Guwahati, Barauni, Lucknow, Varanasi. And the
list
> could go on... The point is *not* that Delhi should not have SF and
> Raj/Shatabdi trains - Delhi is India's capital and it *should* have
good
> trains. The point is that the distribution of SF and Raj/Shatabdi
> trains ought to be much more equitable. For instance, Delhi-Patna
> already had a Rajdhani (the Calcutta one via Patna),
Delhi-Secunderabad
> (the Bangalore Raj) - shouldn't linking
Mumbai-Chennai-Howrah-Bangalore
> to each other by Rajdhani-type trains get precedence over double and
> triple Rajdhani connections between the same city and Delhi?

Introduction of new trains, especially superfasts and Rajdhani/Shatabdi,
has more to do with the whims and fancies of
politicians (including the rly. minister) rather than the needs of any
particular region. IMHO, the most neglected route is Mumbai-Chennai
with NO superfast train connecting the two (and about 50% of it is still
single-track). Jaffer Sharreif (sp?) took care of Bangalore with the
Delhi Rajdhani, Mysore-Chennai Shatabdi, Lalbagh Exp., Hubli-Bangalore
Shatabdi (now demoted to a superfast exp.), etc. What we need is a
railway minister from the South, or someone who is truly concerned about
the traveling needs of folks outside his constituency.

Vijay

From: Pushkar Apte <apte@spdc.email

Subject: Superfast Trains

Date: 11 Feb 1998 13:26:00 -0500

The recent discussion on train re-routing via KR brings me to a question
re: superfast trains. My understanding is that some time ago, a kind
soul had sued IR, and wonder of wonders - the courts gave a timely
decision in his favor saying that IR could not arbitrarily designate
trains as Superfast - they need an objective criterion. This has
financial implications - because IR extracts a sizable SF surcharge.
The resultant criterion was set to be 55 kmph over the entire run (incl.
halts) to merit the 2000 series number and SF designation. Is this
still the case? If someone knows more on this issue, can you please
post?

For the record, I agree heartily with Vijay re: the dearth of Superfast
trains for non-Delhi cities. Mumbai has ZERO SF trains to anywhere in
the south. Hyderabad recently got an upgrade in this respect, with
Falaknuma and Charminar Exps becoming SF, and Chennai-Bangalore have
good SF links - but apart from that, the situation for interlinking
Southern cities is also pretty bad for SF exp. trains. Calcutta does
not have SF links to Guwahati, Barauni, Lucknow, Varanasi. And the list
could go on... The point is *not* that Delhi should not have SF and
Raj/Shatabdi trains - Delhi is India's capital and it *should* have good
trains. The point is that the distribution of SF and Raj/Shatabdi
trains ought to be much more equitable. For instance, Delhi-Patna
already had a Rajdhani (the Calcutta one via Patna), Delhi-Secunderabad
(the Bangalore Raj) - shouldn't linking Mumbai-Chennai-Howrah-Bangalore
to each other by Rajdhani-type trains get precedence over double and
triple Rajdhani connections between the same city and Delhi?

Oh well...

-Pushkar

Regards,
Pushkar
-------

From: poras p.saklatwalla <pps@godrejnet.email

Subject: Re: Konkan Rly finally gets on tracks

Date: 12 Feb 1998 22:30:00 -0500

On Wed, 11 Feb 1998 Vijay.Balasubramanian@xula.email wrote:

>
> > on this route are now gone. In fact, IR started a new Mumbai-Bangalore
> > Express (via Pune, Satara, Miraj, Hubli) 1017 Dn/1018 Up on this newly
> > converted B.G. track. I found the timings very odd, at least for the
> > Down Train. It leaves Mumbai at around 22 Hours and reaches Bangalore
> the
> > third day morning in very early hours (around 04:00). I wonder if
> >someone
> > travelling from Mumbai to Bangalore will ever prefer this train in
> place
> >of
> > the other established Udyan or Kurla-Bangalore Expresses (via Wadi,
> >Guntakal).
>
> The timings are, indeed, odd and pathetic. If it had been Delhi instead
> of Mumbai, they would have started a bunch of trains to Bangalore (via
> Miraj-Hubli), including a Rajdhani and another superfast. But it is
> Mumbai and we have to contend with a snailer that takes nearly
> 29 hrs. in the Dn. direction :-( :-( (a superfast Mumbai-Hubli-
> Bangalore exp. with 5-6 halts could make it in less than 21 hrs.!!!).
>
>
> Vijay
>

P.P.SAKLATWALLA.
EXTN :4226/4232/4237

I very much agree with you Vijay that the IR mandarins have neither got
any ideas of how to run a Railway neither do they use their heads while
scheduling trains. Earlier with a change at Miraj for Bangalore we use to
reach in 25 1/2 hrs, i.e. from Mumbai by Mahalaxmi Express and then by
M.G. train to Bangalore. I also agree that had it been Delhi we would
have got a Rajdhani, a Shatabdi and possibly another S.F. TRAIN. Mumbai
does get step motherly treatment from Mandarins at Rail Bhavan,be it
trains, be it timings, be it development. This is the price we pay for
not staying in the Capital of the country where the Political giants and
jokers stay :-(
Any way lets hope sooner or later we have this line also developing fast,
with a Railway minister from Hubli or Dharwar. Ha! ha!

From: poras p.saklatwalla <pps@godrejnet.email

Subject: Re: Konkan Rly finally gets on tracks

Date: 12 Feb 1998 22:57:00 -0500

On Wed, 11 Feb 1998, Sankar wrote:

> 1.Which route the diverted-via-the-Konkan Railway-trains will follow: your
> guess is as good as mine.
> 2.An interesting bit of news,there is a proposed link between Poona
> (Chinchwad,to be exact) and Roha.Once this link is finished,it will be
> safe to assume that trains canmeet the Konkan Railway from either end
> ex-Poona:via Poona-Chinchwad-Roha, or Poona-Miraj-Madgaon.
> 4. You seem to be very fond of double WDM/2 headed trains,my friend.The
> WDM/2s will soon go the way of steam,the way electrification is spreading
> in leaps and bounds on the IR.Almost all trunk lines (except Bombay-Madras
> and Howrah-Madras) are already under the wires.Of course,I say this
> figuratively-don't take a literal word for word meaning!Now I don't know
> when the Konkan Railway will be electrified,but you cn rest assured that
> much of the route the diverted trains will take will be under the wires.So
> don' hope to see too many "double WDM/2 headed" superfasts! One the KR,
> maybe,for a while.
> 5.As two of our members have already mentioned,the Miraj-Bangalore route
> has already been re-gauged to bg.There are two trains running on that route:
> 1017/1018 BOMBAY VT-BANGALORE EXPRESS
> (Bom-Poona-Miraj-Belgaum-Hubli-Blr), and
> 6505/6506 BANGALORE-NIZAMUDDIN (I think) SWARNAJAYANTI EXPRESS
> (Blr-Hubli-Belgaum-Miraj-Poona-Daund-Manmad-Bhusaval-
> Itarsi-Gwalior-Agra-Nizamuddin (Delhi).
> 6.Tragic as it may sound,one has to ultimately accept the facts of life.All
> those magnificent YDs and YGs and YPs of the Miraj-Goa route have bitten
> the dust.
> Best regards.
> Shankar.
>
>
> Shankar
I hope that my WDM/2'S don't meet the same fate as the Black Beauties
have had to face. I am extremely fond of WDM'S AND DOUBLE HEADED
nicely coloured locos. Previously during college days in late 80's I
use to be at BCT at 4.00 p.m. thrice a week to see Rajdhani depart. Oh it
was grand to see it depart from BCT. Once when I travelled on the train,
it was too good an experience with the train literally going full speed
it was a sight to see the Rajdhani on the Narmada Bridge, with the double
headed WDM FROM RATLAM IN THE SAME LIVELRY as the train.

The Swarnajayanti express from NDLS TO MYSORE has a beautiful livelry? has
anyone of you all seen it. I saw it at Poona in May when the train was
introduced.

It is indeed sad that A person like me has rarely travelled by a Steam
loco hauled train as by the time I was born the electric locos were on the
line. Can I see a broad guage Steam loco anywhere in the country on the
tracks ? If yes please let me know. It is really disgusting to note that
the YP'S AND THE OTHER STEAMS on the Goa - Miraj line are biting dust,
instead of passenger trains in the country.

Regards,
Poras Saklatwalla
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> At 02:28 PM 2/11/98 +0530, you wrote:
> >On Sat, 24 Jan 1998, Prakash Tendulkar wrote:
> >
> >> Konkan Rly finally gets on tracks
> >> EXPRESS NEWS SERVICE
> >>
> >> MUMBAI, January 24: The massive Konkan Railway link cutting across
> >> the Western Coast is finally complete with the total project cost
> >> mounting to Rs 3,370-cr, a considerably high debt servicing burden
> >> and even higher expectation of future profitability.
> >>
> >> After too many hiccups, Konkan Railway engineers removed the last
> >> hurdle by completing the Pernem tunnel in North Goa opening up the
> >> 760-km-long rail link between Roha and Mangalore. On January 26, a
> >> DMU train would wind its way between Ratnagiri in Maharashtra and
> >> Karwar in Karnataka.
> >>
> >> The ambitious project undertaken on Build Operate and Transfer
> >> (BOT) basis now enters the second and crucial phase of operation.
> >> The operating phase begins with about Rs 210-cr debt servicing
> >> burden and a challenge of raising working capital till the time
> >> Konkan Railway Corporation begins to break even.
> >>
> >> The whole project cost was initially estimated at around Rs 1042-
> >> cr but delays and topographical difficulties effected the
> >> Corporation spending Rs 3370-cr and the debt/equity ratio has
> >> exceeded 4:1. Now the corporation would need to generate about Rs
> >> 300-cr every year to run its operations.
> >>
> >> According to KRC's managing director B Rajaram, the corporation
> >> would have to raise funds through short term loans from financial
> >> institutions to bridge the revenue-outflow gap. As per today's
> >> projections, the Corporation would be generating Rs 25 to 30 lakh
> >> per day through passenger traffic and about Rs 90 lakh a day from
> >> diverted freight traffic. The Corporation is expected to break
> >> even in two years time, Rajaram said.
> >>
> >> The Konkan railway is merely a corridor to take traffic diverted
> >> from the existing long route on the South Central Railway. Yet
> >> another problem that the KRC may face is the availability of
> >> rolling stock. The Corporation does not have a rolling stock of
> >> its own. It would have to depend on the Ministry of Railways to
> >> procure wagons on lease. The zonal railways have been finding it
> >> tough to get wagons in time.
> >>
> >> However, according to Rajaram, the Konkan Railway would contribute
> >> towards easing the wagon shortage as the corridor promises to
> >> reduce the travelling time between North and South. For passenger
> >> traffic the KRC has promising future plans. At present five trains
> >> are running between various stations on the Konkan route. In
> >> addition, Mumbai-Managalore/Kochi Netravati Express,
> >> Rajkot/Gandhidham-Kochi/Trivandram Express, New Delhi Mangalore/
> >> Kochi Mangala Express and Hazarat Nizammudin-Trivandram Rajdhani
> >> would be diverted on the Konkan route. Besides, Mumbai-Goa
> >> Shatabdi Express would also start once the trials are completed.
> >>
> >
> >P.P.SAKLATWALLA.
> >EXTN :4226/4232/4237
> >
> >On the trains to be diverted to KR the Trivandrum Delhi Rajdhani will have
> >to come alll the way to Diva and then proceed on KR to Trivandrum ? what
> >time will it save at all ? Else what is the alternative route. Imagine
> >the Mumbai - Madgaon Shatabdi at high speed on KR and if it is Double
> >headed with WDM it will be a real beauty and experience to travel !
> >Will a Delhi _ Goa Rajdhani also start operations, soon ? What happens to
> >the Goa express currently on the line between NDLS AND MADGAON VIA PUNE
> >AND MIRAJ. Has the Miraj route been made into a Broad Gauge ? will trains
> >to Bangalore and Goa run on that route also. Can some one furnish me more
> >details about this route. Are meter guage trains still run on steam
> >engines near Dharwar/ Hubli.?
> >
> >This route to Goa is really picturesque and will be missed by most
> >travellers to Goa by train like me. I was really fond of this route and
> >travelled frequently to Goa and Bangalore on this route,seeing a lot of
> >Black Beauties on the way. Please get back to me as soon as someone has
> >some information.
> >
> >
> >Poras Saklatwalla
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

P.P.SAKLATWALLA.
EXTN :4226/4232/4237

From: H.Hubbert <hubbert@cww.email

Subject: Re: Change in IR policy?

Date: 11 Feb 1998 20:09:00 -0500

> What then are WAP/4-5-6? I saw a WAP/6 at the head of the New Delhi-Allaha-
> bad Prayagraj Express (24 cars) in Nov. last year,with a ribbed body profile
> and fully recessed twin headlights,she most definitely did not
> appear to be built in India.
> Can someone out there fill me in?
>
> I read in the Indian Express in 1995 or so that a WAP was tested on the
> New Delhi-Kanpur section for a top speed of 180 kmph.I first thought it was
> a misprint,but then the same article repeated that figure again.
> Any idea which WAP it was?
> Best regards.
> Shankar.

WAP 5 class has been build by ADtranz (ABB Daimler Benz Transportation
Corporation) and SLM.

I saw them first time on route last 12th.October
hauling the Mumbai Rajdani which I entered the train in Ratlam
for Delhi.
It has AC 3-Phase high-performance-traction-motors.
Installed power should be about 6.4 MW - with only 8 wheels !!!
This power-management is only possible with computer-controll.
Another high-light is the electric-energy-resaving brake-controll,
converting braking-energy back into the wires.

The Deutsche Bahn is renewing its fleet with this technique like many
other countries.
India should adopt this technologies for home-production.
I came to know that BHEL is engeeniering in this direction.

Heinrich

Heinrich

I hope India will start mass-prduction

From: poras p.saklatwalla <pps@godrejnet.email

Subject: Re: Superfast Trains

Date: 12 Feb 1998 23:22:00 -0500

On Wed, 11 Feb 1998, Pushkar Apte wrote:

> The recent discussion on train re-routing via KR brings me to a question
> re: superfast trains. My understanding is that some time ago, a kind
> soul had sued IR, and wonder of wonders - the courts gave a timely
> decision in his favor saying that IR could not arbitrarily designate
> trains as Superfast - they need an objective criterion. This has
> financial implications - because IR extracts a sizable SF surcharge.
> The resultant criterion was set to be 55 kmph over the entire run (incl.
> halts) to merit the 2000 series number and SF designation. Is this
> still the case? If someone knows more on this issue, can you please
> post?
>
> For the record, I agree heartily with Vijay re: the dearth of Superfast
> trains for non-Delhi cities. Mumbai has ZERO SF trains to anywhere in
> the south. Hyderabad recently got an upgrade in this respect, with
> Falaknuma and Charminar Exps becoming SF, and Chennai-Bangalore have
> good SF links - but apart from that, the situation for interlinking
> Southern cities is also pretty bad for SF exp. trains. Calcutta does
> not have SF links to Guwahati, Barauni, Lucknow, Varanasi. And the list
> could go on... The point is *not* that Delhi should not have SF and
> Raj/Shatabdi trains - Delhi is India's capital and it *should* have good
> trains. The point is that the distribution of SF and Raj/Shatabdi
> trains ought to be much more equitable. For instance, Delhi-Patna
> already had a Rajdhani (the Calcutta one via Patna), Delhi-Secunderabad
> (the Bangalore Raj) - shouldn't linking Mumbai-Chennai-Howrah-Bangalore
> to each other by Rajdhani-type trains get precedence over double and
> triple Rajdhani connections between the same city and Delhi?
>
> Oh well...
>
> -Pushkar
>
>
> Regards,
> Pushkar
> -------
>
>

P.P.SAKLATWALLA.
EXTN :4226/4232/4237

Pushkar,
The kind soul who filed a suit against the railway was none other than a
Parsi gentlemen by the name of Firoze Amroliwalla of Mumbai. He is a
social worker and an activist , but thanks to him and his filing of suit
against the railway The MUMBAI- POONA PRAGATI EXP, MUMBAI - POONA
INDRAYANI EXP, THE MUMBAI - FIROZPUR PUNJAB MAIL AND THE MUMBAI - LUCKNOW
PUSPAK EXPRESS got converted to ordinary trains. However Punjab Mail and
Pushpak Express have once again been given the original status as 2137 Dn
and 2133 DN
The axe could have fallen on Paschim Express, Frontier Mail and a few
other trains, but the courts decided against it. I was at the courts when
the case was being heard and there were hilarious scenes in the court when
the case was being fought. However Mr.Amroliwalla recently lost his son
in a road accident and the fan clubs members share his grief with him.

Pushkar one more thing, why are the railways not introducing anymore mails
and only expresses. I mean thats surprising since, once upon a time the
mails were considered as prestigious trains. Now all of a sudden why this
sudden dearth of mail trains ? I distinctly remember that there used to be
Poona Mail when I was in school and one fine day it was scrapped to give
way to Double Decker Singhad express later.
I am sure we can have a Lucknow Mail, Bangalore Mail Etc. Don't know how
these jokers in Delhi work.
Please do give your comments

Regards,

Poras Saklatwalla,

From: S. Kumar <s.kumar@qm.email

Subject: superfast trains, HWH-Chennai line

Date: 12 Feb 1998 15:30:00 -0500

Apart from the "speed" of the train, the "superfast" trains are all
supposed to have only reserved accomodation.

As Sankar points out, superfasts do not necessarily have the minimum
number of stops between destinations. This is particularly true of
the "grand oldies" such as the Grand Trunk Express, the Kalka, the
Golden Temple (Frontier) and the Mumbai-HWH mail via Nagpur.

I remember the excitement when the max speed for the non-Rajdhani
trains was increased to 110 kmph, and the trains which were permitted
to run at these speeds were first classified as superfast. The
coaches on these trains were marked "fit for 110 KPH".

The grand oldies have done well in maintaining their halt pattern
without much deterioration. I would classify the GT express, the
Kalka (only between Delhi and HWH) and the GT mail (only between N.
Delhi and Mumbai) in one category, followed by the Mumbai-HWH
mail in a lower category. I never thought that the Punjab Mail fit
the superfast bill unless they have speeded it up.

In contrast to the oldies, many of the relatively new "upstarts" have fallen by the wayside.
Examples are the Ganga Kaveri Express, the Jhelum Express, the
Amritsar Howrah Himgiri Express etc.

As far as the HWH-Chennai line is concerned, I believe
electrification is continuing both on the SC Rly north of Vijayawada
and on the SE Rly between Kharagpur and Vizag (HWH-Kharagpur and
Vijayawada-Chennai are already electrified). The line is double
track throughout. The HWH-Chennai Coromandel Express is the fastest train, and
is comparable to the NDLS-Chennai TN express in speed and halt
frequency. I remember when the Coromandal express had just three
(yes just three!) scheduled halts on its nearly 1700 km run; Bhubaneswar (2
minutes in the middle of the night), Visakapatnam (then called
Waltair, for 20 minutes for breakfast and reversal of direction) and
Vijayawada (for 12 minutes for lunch). They have murdered the train
especially on SE Rly by adding many more halts. Other fast trains
include the HWH-Hyderabad Falaknuma Express (surprisingly not
classified as superfast) and the superfast Bhubaneswar-Hyderabad Konarak
Express. One has also to mention the grand old lady of this line,
the HWH-Chennai Mail or simply the "Mail" to people on this route.
Before the advent of the likes of Coromandel etc., the Mail was the
undisputed queen of this route. If ever people without reservation
got on to the train the surest way to get them off was to say "this
is the Mail!" and they would get off! I have seen this happen many
times. My best experience travelling on IR has been the early
morning run on the southbound Mail between Khurda Rd and Berhampur
along the Chilka lake with a picture postcard view of the sunrise
over the lake as the train travelled at high speed with engine
sounding occasionally and the cool wind hitting my face.

Kumar

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