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From: C.L.Zeni <>

Subject: Re: [Fwd: Long Hauls etc.]

Date: 26 Jul 1999 08:39:57 -0500


> From: raymond/Polaris@polaris.email

> Why does the WDM2 spew out sparks at full throttle. I thought that was
a sure
> sign of old technology, inspite of what our friend Sunil Bajpai says.

Throwing sparks is, to me, not a sign of old technology. The sparks are
actually bits of carbon that have accumulated in the exhaust system
during periods of extending idling. When the loco is throttled up, the
rush of hot gases heats up these bits of carbon, and some get thrown out
as glowing sparks. I see it here in the US on the newest locomotives...
--
Craig Zeni - REPLY TO -->> clzeni at mindspring dot com
<A HREF="http://www.mindspring.com/~clzeni/index.html">http://www.mindspring.com/~clzeni/index.html</A>

Society for Preservation Of Southern Culture
Our motto: Y'all say hey to your mama 'n' them, hear?

From: Tim & Anita Wakeman <>

Subject: Re: [Fwd: YDM4 vs. WDM 2]

Date: 26 Jul 1999 09:06:25 -0500


Joydeep Dutta wrote:

When you open the first notch you will hear a sound
> from the electrical control panel which is in the wall separating the
cab
> and the generator room.
> That is the sound of the series contactors picking up.

While riding an Alco C420 one night on a stiff grade these contactors
would be "flashing" like lighting stikes from behind the panel. The crew
did'nt seem to mind, they said it happens all the time with this loco.
Eventually I got used to it too.

Tim

From: Joydeep Dutta <>

Subject: Re: WDM 2 from the footplate

Date: 26 Jul 1999 09:49:10 -0500



Dear Krish
The GF switch actually is the one which sends the current to the
traction
motors. The contactors are low voltage circuits used to set up the
traction
motor connections. The series parallel connections
are the first one where traction motor numbers 1 and 4, 2 and 5 and 3
and 6
as far as I recollect are connected in series and each of these blocks
are
connected in parallel.
Do send in the copy of the control panel and stand pic to me. I will
tell
you about all the parts. I can read them like a book they are so very a
part
of my beign
Joydeep

>From: "Anand Krishnan" <krish_nand@hotmail.email
>To: iti@vsnl.email
>CC: joydeepdutta@hotmail.email
>Subject: Re: WDM 2 from the footplate
>Date: Mon, 26 Jul 1999 19:17:02 IST
>
>Hi Apurva,
>
>>Gear lever ? In a WDM 2 it would be
>>known as the
>>throttle ! You can also prevent the loco from moving by
>>opening the Generator
>>Field (GF) circuit breaker located in the corner of the
>>control stand.
> I am still not sure Apurva. This one decides the direction.
>Sitting facing the panel(i.e facing the long hood say) we push to our
right
>the loco direction is in the direction of the long hood. If we push it
to
>the left extreme it is the direction of the short hood. The middle
position
>is neutral. Yes i saw a demo of the GF being opened and the throttle
being
>given. Yes i can recollect.
>
>>Let us do this marking of the WDM 2 cab project. Send me the
>>picture by email and we
>>would jointly annotate it and put it on the web. I had put up
>>a list of the
>>switches in the cab of a DM 2 sometimes last year. I could
>>remail that message
>>on the IRFCA if you so desire.
> Yes i shall send u the snap by mail. May be we can covert it inot
a
>bmp do a modification by adding some text/indexes and then give an
>explanation.
>
>Kind regards,
>Anand
>
>
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From: Anand Krishnan <>

Subject: Re: WDM 2 from the footplate

Date: 26 Jul 1999 10:18:25 -0500


Hey all,
Joydeep-da, that was pretty interesting stuff. Possibly my
footplating (shunting) experience could have been more educative had we
avoided the language problem. The shunter very frankly admitted that he
could not make it to the higher grade (asst. driver) because he quite
could'nt come to terms with English. I can put up a full view of a WDM2A

control panel on my page and Joydeep could improvise on giving us the
precise functions of every gadget visible.
BTW, Apurva bhai u can hear the great roar by keep the long-short hood
direction rod(in level with the driver's seat) in neutral(middle
position)
and keep shifting the gear rod from 0 to 8. The loco doesnt move an
inch.
The demo of how the dy. brake functions was also very good.I was amazed.

Kind regards,
Anand.K


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From: Anand Krishnan <>

Subject: Re: [Fwd: [Fwd: YDM4 vs. WDM 2]]

Date: 26 Jul 1999 10:57:18 -0500


Hi Joydeep,
This is just unbeleivable stuff !! Joydeep-da i am just phew!!!
zapped at
the amount if info this mail is giving. May your tribe increase. I just
wanted to clarify so many of the points i had in mind which i could not
ask
the shunter of a WDM2A during my recent visit to Shimoga. Probably u can

pin-point every function when i put up the snaps on my page. I shall
preserve this mail until then.

>track layout before you. See whether the brake pipe pressure is at
5kg/sqcm
>and the auxillary air pressure is at 6kg/sqcm. I am assuming an
airbrake
>express pasenger train. Just lower your brake pipe pressure once using
the
>A9 automatic train brake. See how fast the brake lapping takes place.
If
Mine was a vaccum braked loco. Is the mechanism different from
that
of air-braked locos. This one just had the normal loco-brake lever and
the
train-brake lever and of course one for the dyanamic brake.

>thats ok then once you get the signal release the independent brake and

>open
>the throttle ie to the first notch. Let the train start rolling and
then
>open the second notch. Allow your loco to change over from the loop
Actually my shunter did not actually follow all these. He just
kept
changing notches going back and forth from 0 to 3. May be these can be
eased
a little for shunting purposes. Or if the loco is not atached to any
wagons
and is free the ability to control is more i guess.

>Kharagpur use to say. When you open the first notch you will hear a
sound
>from the electrical control panel which is in the wall separating the
cab
>and the generator room.
I actually saw those huge fuse like connectors. These are made of

something similar to porcelain and conductor strips embedded in it. When
the
notches were changed it gave a frightening spark along with a BANG-THUD
and
came in contact with the switches. Is this what u were actually
explaining ?

>field connection. As the train reaches the maximum speed gradually
decrease
>the throttle notch and keep it a position where you can maintain the
speed.
Will reducing the notches marginally also reduce the speed. In
other
words will i be able to work up 90kmph at 6th notch as well as 7th. In
that
case what do the notches actually mean. I guess its basically gearing. I
can
do 40kmph on a 3rd and a 4th gear on my bike. Is this principle similar
? It
might be a little silly asking you this but in locos there nothing
separate
called accelerator i guess and its the notch lever that does both these
functions.

>In the next letter I will talk about how to brake a WDM2 working at
110km/h
>since I myself have done it so many times.
Just waiting to hear from you again. Keep such fascinating mails

coming. Me also a Deisel freak.

kind regards
Anand


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From: Rajan Mathew <>

Subject: Re: Trivandrum Rajdhani via KR

Date: 26 Jul 1999 11:12:31 -0500


Hi Vijay ... Thanks for the feedback

I am in the process of completely redesigning the site
but still felt the need to keep the old pages somewhere. the table is
also
being updated.

The 0103/0104 - Mumbai Madgaon Intercity Express - reffered to in the
TAAG
as Konkan Star Express is a daily train and very coveniently links
Mumbai
with Madgaon.
It has 2 AC Chair Cars, 7 second class sitting, two SLR coaches and a
pantry.

Rajan

> Nice to have the site up again! You may want to update your links
inside
> the KR timetable home page to point to the new pages. Also, how about
> adding the halt times at Kota for the TVC Raj. now that it has been
upgraded
> to a passenger halt?
>
> What is the deal with this new Mumbai-Madgaon day train? Has this
already
> been introduced? If so, why not add its schedule as well?
>
> Vijay
>
> >Infact either way - Kankanadi to Panvel or vice versa - you complete
the
> >entire KR stretch by day on the Rajdhani
> >
> >Regards - Rajan
> >
> >From: Royston Ellis <royston@pan.email
> >
> > > Gang,
> > >
> > > I see from the e-mail from Poras that the Rajdhani from Trivandrum
to
> >Delhi
> > > now goes via the KR. I've missed all this and don't have any
current
> > > timetables. Could someone let me have details of days/itinerary.
It
> >sounds
> > > a great journey.

From: Rajan Mathew <>

Subject: Re: WCAG1 at Mumbai (?)

Date: 26 Jul 1999 11:20:11 -0500


I spotted a WCAG - 1 at Kurla on the line beyond platform 8 (up harbour
line)
Didn't note its number though ....
This one had the original Bhel colours adn was not repainted. Seemed to
be
quite new too

----- Original Message -----
From: Apurva Bahadur <iti@vsnl.email
To: S.B.Mehta <sarosh@godrej.email
Cc: <irfca@cs.email
Sent: Monday, July 19, 1999 3:32 PM
Subject: Re: WCAG1 at Mumbai (?)


>
>
> "S.B.Mehta" wrote:
>
> > Hi, all,
> >
> > saw a WCAG1 hauling a container rake at Ghatkopar stn. yesterday
> > afternoon. Livery is blue cabs and cream in-between and looks
> > exactly like a WCAM2/3 only maybe a bit bigger. The loco appeared
> > brand new. Any details?
>
> Maybe there is a WCAG 1.
> I.S. Anand (the computer challenged rail nut from Mumbai with his ear
> to the ground) had told me almost an year ago that a freight only
> version of the WCAM 3 was on the cards for the use in the ghats
amongst
> other things. I am quite sure that this is nothing much but a WCAM 3
> with regeared bogies (high adhesion types) and a more powerful
> transformer.
> Maybe BHEL's website would have more details. This loco would replace
> the WCG 2 someday.
> Inspite of its dumb looks the WCAM 3 has a lot of high technology
> inside and is proving to be a reliable loco in the most difficult main
> line sections on the IR.
>
> Apurva
>
> >
>
>
>

From: raymond/Polaris <>

Subject: Long Hauls

Date: 26 Jul 1999 20:46:51 -0500




Dear Apurva / Joydeep,

Regarding long diesel hauls, Apurva had mentioned ET - GHY on the Mumbai
Guwahati Exp. Any idea about the Lohit Exp. from JAT to GHY, or the
Avadh Assam
from DLI to GHY, or the Amritsar Mail from ASR to Asansol. Let me know
where the
electric traction comes in.

Why does the WDM2 spew out sparks at full throttle. I thought that was a
sure
sign of old technology, inspite of what our friend Sunil Bajpai says. I
also
remember my driver friend saying that the full load current on the WDM2
was 960
amps.. That seems to be rather low for 2600 HP. My friend Benedict
Xavier and
his colleague R.C.Vel, used to drive the T.N. and G.T. between BZA and
MAS from
1972 to 1979 - 'A' grade drivers both. I took a ride with them on the
G.T.
sometime in 1975, 16 coaches, single headed. I remember those days the
first
continuous welded rail block on the Southern Railway was between
Peddapriya and
Polireddipalem on the MAS - Gudur stretch. The whole train would
suddenly go
silent on that stretch.

What else ? Wonderful sounds on the engine, right from full out
acceleration at
the 8th notch, right to cruising at 110 kmph on the 6th notch. Do write
back,
guys with your feedback.

Regards

Raymond Arogyaswamy

From: Joydeep Dutta <>

Subject: Re: [Fwd: Long Hauls etc.]

Date: 26 Jul 1999 21:00:23 -0500



The 5651/5652 Lohit express is the longest diesel haul in the country
Lohit is worked from GHY to JAT by a GONDA and sometimes a MALDA TOWM/
NEW
GUWAHATI based WDM2 loco.
Lohit is a complete diesel train.
But WDM2 , the standard one has been removed from many toplink diesel
workings out of New Delhi. The Lucknow Mail, Shramjeevi Express and the

Kashi -Viswanath Express are now hauled by the 3100/2950 hp WDM2C
with its bald forehead and with the driver sitting on the left. A driver
on
one of these links told me that they sit in the WDM2C and dream about
WDM2.
Joydeep

>From: Apurva Bahadur <iti@vsnl.email
>To: IRFCA <irfca@cs.email
>Subject: [Fwd: Long Hauls etc.]
>Date: Mon, 26 Jul 1999 20:40:41 +0530
>
>IRFCA must hear of this. Raymond, do mark a cc to the whole gang !
><< message3.txt >>


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From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Re: [Fwd: Long Hauls etc.]

Date: 27 Jul 1999 01:32:05 -0500


I am in touch with a lot of people who know a lot about diesel engines.
One of them
opined that there has been very little fundamental development after the
60s as far
as large engines are concerned. This is primarily due to the extreme
expense
involved for research. Even the latest technology engines with the
current
European or American emission standards are actually based on 60s
technology. Only
the bits of the latest technology and newer materials are added to the
same basic
engine. Although I do not think this is totally true (the new EMD 'H'
diesel is a
new engine), there is an element of truth in it. So if the Alco 251 is
an old
technology mill, there is not option that we have. In any case the
sparks from the
exhaust is one of the charms of the WDM 2.
I have seen a picture somewhere on the web of an American loco with a
proper flame
at the exhaust stack. This was due to the accumulation of oily residues
in the
silencer. While the Indian Locos lack an exhaust silencer, the manifold
must be
having a large depositions of soot and oil.

Apurva


> Throwing sparks is, to me, not a sign of old technology.

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Re: [Fwd: Long Hauls etc.]

Date: 27 Jul 1999 01:32:05 -0500


I am in touch with a lot of people who know a lot about diesel engines.
One of them
opined that there has been very little fundamental development after the
60s as far
as large engines are concerned. This is primarily due to the extreme
expense
involved for research. Even the latest technology engines with the
current
European or American emission standards are actually based on 60s
technology. Only
the bits of the latest technology and newer materials are added to the
same basic
engine. Although I do not think this is totally true (the new EMD 'H'
diesel is a
new engine), there is an element of truth in it. So if the Alco 251 is
an old
technology mill, there is not option that we have. In any case the
sparks from the
exhaust is one of the charms of the WDM 2.
I have seen a picture somewhere on the web of an American loco with a
proper flame
at the exhaust stack. This was due to the accumulation of oily residues
in the
silencer. While the Indian Locos lack an exhaust silencer, the manifold
must be
having a large depositions of soot and oil.

Apurva


> Throwing sparks is, to me, not a sign of old technology.

From: Anand Krishnan <>

Subject: WDM2C and WDP1

Date: 27 Jul 1999 05:26:32 -0500


Hi all,

>one of these links told me that they sit in the WDM2C and dream about
WDM2.
>Joydeep
>
Do they feel that the WDM2Cs arent to their liking or they still
feel
the same as sitting inside a WDM2A. I guess the acceleration is quite
fast
in WDM2Cs. All major express trains out of Sec'bad and Hyd are now
either
WDP1s or WDM2Cs and all these are based at KZJ. I forgot to mention that
KZJ
has got around 5-6 WDP1s recently from DLW. But superfast/express trains
are
hauled by WDM2Cs and not WDP1s.I have to get back to DLW home page to
check
out their differences. Did i ever mention that the maintenance/overhaul
of
certain WDM2Cs are done by GOC. That seemed a little strange, but GOC
seems
to be the best. Cheers SR !!

Kind regards,
Anand


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From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Re: [Fwd: [Fwd: YDM4 vs. WDM 2]]

Date: 27 Jul 1999 08:19:37 -0500


> I actually saw those huge fuse like connectors. These are made
of
> something similar to porcelain and conductor strips embedded in it.
When the
> notches were changed it gave a frightening spark along with a
BANG-THUD and
> came in contact with the switches. Is this what u were actually
explaining ?

When the forward/reverse lever (near the driver's thigh) is moved in
appropriate
direction, pneumatic reverser moves as well, connecting the motors in
forward and
reverse positions. There is a procedure in the operator's manual which
allows this
reverser to be physically forced in one positions if stuck. That sharp
sound made by
the switchgear is permanently etched in my mind.
I remember during one footplating session, the shower of sparks that the
WCM 2 was
giving out as the driver notched up. The flash was visible on the walls
of the
cuttings and tunnels as the WCM 2 hauled the 1063 Dn. Chennai express
towards Pune in
the night.

Have you noticed the notch numbers 1 to 8 which show up in a small
window in the
control stand, AND the 'd' letter in a similar window when the loco is
in the dynamic
braking position ? As the dynamic brake effort is increase, the small
'd' is replaced
with the larger 'd's.

Apurva

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Re: [Fwd: Long Hauls etc.]

Date: 27 Jul 1999 08:28:35 -0500




Joydeep Dutta wrote:

> The 5651/5652 Lohit express is the longest diesel haul in the country
> Lohit is worked from GHY to JAT by a GONDA and sometimes a MALDA TOWM/
NEW
> GUWAHATI based WDM2 loco.
> Lohit is a complete diesel train.

What is the shed code of the Malda Town ? I did not know that Malda had
a diesel shed.
Which others on the ER ? Howrah, Andal, GHY, Gomoh, Patratu (much of the
coal traffic
near Singrauli is hauled by PTR powers). Any others ?

> The Lucknow Mail, Shramjeevi Express and the
> Kashi -Viswanath Express are now hauled by the 3100/2950 hp WDM2C
> with its bald forehead and with the driver sitting on the left. A
driver on
> one of these links told me that they sit in the WDM2C and dream about
WDM2.

Can you elaborate on why the driver's miss their older and less powerful
loco? I think
the reason may be the UGLY WDM 2C and the fact that the rugged throttle
bar is now
replaced with a sissy looking wheel (rotate one way for motoring and the
other for
dynamic braking). Also subconsciously the diesel drivers have always
driven from the
right side, so the left seat is really the assistant's seat. This was
true in the
steam days also from where most of the diesel drivers have their roots.

Apurva

From: Sharad Ketkar <>

Subject: to all member

Date: 28 Jul 1999 02:35:53 -0500


 
 To all member of IRFCA
      I am the new member of this club . My name is Mukund Ketkar. I also interested in railways. I like to read about railways, locomotives etc. I am working on the project of model railway . I also have a scale model  locomotive tracks, coaches etc. it is a hobby in other country but it is very costly I have some of the part of its. Now some company have there distributarin  India. this type of model are also available in "India Hobby Center" in Marian lines (in mumbai).
       If anybody know about it . Give the information to me.

From: S.Shankar <>

Subject: [Fwd: Be careful while you ride.

Date: 28 Jul 1999 03:04:56 -0500


Hello,
Although not a railway subject, much less an IR one, just some terrific
humor I thought I simply MUST share with fellow irfca-ites!
Shankar

From: Vijay Balasubramanian <>

Subject: April issue of IR magazine

Date: 28 Jul 1999 06:41:14 -0500


I am still waiting for my April issue. Any of you 'overseas'
subscribers (Shankar,.....) received the magazine yet?

Vijay

From: S.Shankar <>

Subject: Diesel Fiesta

Date: 28 Jul 1999 12:47:04 -0500


Hello,

Do check out my first homepage: diesel fiesta.

the url is:

<A HREF="http://members.tripod.com/shankaronline/dslfiesta.htm">http://members.tripod.com/shankaronline/dslfiesta.htm</A>

I had originally intended to pay glowing tribute to the WP, but sadly,
the WP page could not come up as per my expectations.

I am working on it, and hope to have it up and running soon.

Do let me have your comments.

Best regards.

Shankar

From: Vijay Balasubramanian <>

Subject: Re: Diesel Fiesta

Date: 28 Jul 1999 13:47:27 -0500


Great stuff, Shankar. Where did you get the shot of the YDM4A-headed
MG train on a viaduct (from Goa)?
I have the exact same photo on a 198x DLW calendar that was presented to
be at DLW itself.

I have a couple of CLW calendars with blow-ups of various electric
locos. If and when I get hold of a scanner,
I'll create the appropriate image files.

Vijay

>-----Original Message-----
>From: S.Shankar [SMTP:shankie@emirates.email
>Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 1999 3:47 PM
>To: irfca@cs.email
>Subject: Diesel Fiesta
>
>Hello,
>
>Do check out my first homepage: diesel fiesta.
>
>the url is:
>
><A HREF="http://members.tripod.com/shankaronline/dslfiesta.htm">http://members.tripod.com/shankaronline/dslfiesta.htm</A>
>
>I had originally intended to pay glowing tribute to the WP, but sadly,
>the WP page could not come up as per my expectations.
>
>I am working on it, and hope to have it up and running soon.
>
>Do let me have your comments.
>
>Best regards.
>
>Shankar

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Re: Diesel Fiesta

Date: 28 Jul 1999 23:28:10 -0500


Thanks you for the wonderful page Shankar. I am flattered that you
should
choose to name me in the page. In the similar light I feel indebted to
Prakash Tendulkar who went as far as to actually make a website for me
while I was limping along with my HTML. What I miss in your page is
thumbnails. They speed up the loading enormously by allowing multiple
pages to be opened at the same time.

Apurva

"S.Shankar" wrote:

> Hello,
>
> Do check out my first homepage: diesel fiesta.
>
> the url is:
>
> <A HREF="http://members.tripod.com/shankaronline/dslfiesta.htm">http://members.tripod.com/shankaronline/dslfiesta.htm</A>
>
> I had originally intended to pay glowing tribute to the WP, but sadly,
> the WP page could not come up as per my expectations.
>
> I am working on it, and hope to have it up and running soon.
>
> Do let me have your comments.
>
> Best regards.
>
> Shankar

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