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From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Re: Late running of trains (from CR page)

Date: 15 May 1999 00:40:22 -0500


Gang !

One more trivia for our FAQ, apparently the second longest distance
train in
India (Trivandrum - Guwahati weekly express) has NEVER reached on time.
The
worst is over 36 hours late but 4 - 5 hours late is usual. The latest I
have
been on a train is 18 hours by 3004 Dn from CSTM to HWH. The train left
CSTM
on time but was held on Dadar for 3 hours due to a 'bomb scare'. The
strange
thing is that the cops, although present on the platform did not order
the
train to be emptied of passengers, for that matter, they did not come
inside
my FC coupe. After Dadar we were in the sideline and the timing went
downhill all the way. The maximum delay was in the Itarsi - Allahabad
diesel
section. I remember that after Gomoh, the train stopped at virtually
every
station, although this is an electrified double line section or is it a
four
line section - 2 for passenger and 2 for freight traffic ?

Apurva

From: Harsh Vardhan <>

Subject: Re: FAQs

Date: 15 May 1999 01:37:05 -0500



>Greatest Number of Halts:
>In 1987 I travelled from Ajmer to Secunderabad on # 581 Fast Pass.
>During an idle moment (of which there were many on this train) I
counted
>the number of halts in the timetable: I remember the figure reaching
>121. It was such a fantastic trip-all steam then for 1400 kms with YPs
>and YGs in different liveries.

Yes, a fascinating journey from yesteryears with steam banking at
Patalpani-Kalakund ghat near Mhow.
But I think it meant was most halts for a Mail/Express designated train.
Incidently all trains in this section other than M/Exp. are called F.
passenger and there are no slow passengers. While F. passengers charge
the
same fare as a slow passenger, wonder what is the defination of a Fast
passenger on IR?
It would be interesting to note the longest distance travelled by any
passenger/ fast passenger designated train currently on IR.

Harsh

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Re: Double-decker query

Date: 15 May 1999 01:42:44 -0500


> In fact, one of the commuters was
> visibly offended when I objected to him traveling on a reserved coach
> without a reservation - he thought it was his right to do so :-( At
> Lonavala, we decided to upgrade our II class tickets by Pragati to I
class,
> a decision I did not regret!

In the crowded Mumbai Pune sector, unreserved passengers travel in the
reserved
compartments only they do not occupy the reserved seats. However many of
them
carry a lightweight folding seat which they plonk in the passage to the
wrong
side door (almost all the wayside stations have platforms on the left)
and
travel with relative comfort.
A few years ago, it was the norm to travel in the Deccan Queen (before
the
advent of the Pragati Express) without any ticket at all. The gang of
many TCs
would come with their little receipt books and the passengers without
tickets
would produce the money for the tickets plus the fine for traveling
without
ticket. This was the fastest way to get to Pune or Mumbai and all this
was
understood to be the done thing, no words were exchanged between the
ticketless
passenger and the TCs. There was no admonition from the TCs for
traveling
ticketless.
However this practice was clamped down a couple of times by asking the
ticketless passenger to detrain before the train left Mumbai or Pune. I
suspect
that the daily commuter traffic on the WR from MCT to Vapi/ Valsad or
Surat
operates on similar lines.

> In any case, weren't DD trains introduced to cater to short-distance
> commuters (3 hrs. or so) and eliminate overcrowding by increasing the
> seating capacity per coach? If the present Sinhagad Exp. is able to
handle
> traffic with regular coaches then there seems to be no need to have DD
> coaches.

That seems to one of the reasons the DD coaches were phased out. The DD
coached
Sinhagad Express was 10 or 11 coach with a pantry car, while the new day
coached
Sinhagad is now 18 coach long.
One 'oddity' for the Sinhagad DD coach was the provision of a solar
'photo
voltaic' cell panel for charging the batteries on the coach for lighting
and for
operating the large centrifugal blowers at the end of the staircase on
the upper
deck. How economical is charging the batts from a solar source vs belt
driven
generator is quite obvious. There seems to be a project which the
Mumbai
division must do under the heading of 'alternative energy' and although
I am not
aware of the end result of that experiment, but that solar panel was
soon
removed.

Apurva

> >On another note, it must be noted that even the Deccan Queen had a
> >double deck car for a while in between. Soon after the Sinhagad
Express

Sinhagad was always double deckered right from the start, the DQ had
these
coaches for the pass holders. I suspect that the DD coaches could not do
better
than 95 Kmph and that may be one of the reason that these are not in
favour
anymore.

Apurva

From: Harsh Vardhan <>

Subject: Re: FAQs

Date: 15 May 1999 03:54:13 -0500



>Because of gauge conversion, the continuous MG link between Ajmer and
>Secunderabad has been destroyed. Purna-Mudkhed in now BG. So, this
>passenger train runs between Ajmer and Purna and has 99 halts.
>I have checked quite a few passenger trains using my Bradshaw and none
have
>come close to 115 halts.
>


Just to put the record straight, it has 104 stops at the moment. Iam
sure it
had many more than 121(over 150) when it running through to Kacheguda.

Harsh

From: Harsh Vardhan <>

Subject: DHR Conferance.

Date: 15 May 1999 04:44:34 -0500


Dear Viraf,
As mentioned by KJW, the main point discussed during
the
conferance, of importance to us enthusiasts, was that diesels will be
introduced on the line very soon. Whether and how much these will be
succesful on this peculiar line remains to be seen??!!??

The IR's application to UNESCO for inclusion of DHR in world heritage
site
list has obviously ensured that the line will have constant attention of
the
bigwigs and that should ensure its healthy future in times to come.

There are also plans of exchange of locomotives with the Festiniog
railway
and their
2-4-0 tank locomotive called `Linda' would be arriving to work in the
Summers of year 2000. A proposal of recommissioning old DHR stock is
also
pending. Might be that we are able to see a `C' class 4-6-2 tender loco
thrashing on the plains between Sukna and New Jalpaiguri!!!

I will post you a copy of the Secretary, Railway Board's talk on the
subject
of railway heritage preservation.
Regret the delay in my reply.
Regards,

Harsh

-----Original Message-----
From: Dr. K.J. Walker & Mrs. M.E, Heath <kjw_meh@powerup.email
To: IRFCA - mailing list <irfca@cs.email steam_tech@egroups.email
<steam_tech@egroups.email
Date: Friday, May 14, 1999 5:29 PM
Subject: Re: [steam_tech] Fwd: MLRs locos diverted to DHR


>To Nick, Apurva and everyone,
> The announcement that 2 x 250hp Bo diesels from a batch intended
for
>Matheran would be diverted to Darjeeling was made at the Fourth
Darjeeling
>Himalayan Railway Conference in Delhi in mid-April. It came from a very
>senior member of the Railway Board, and may be regarded as
authoritative.
> It should be remembered that the DHR is in a motive power crisis.
Only
>a few of the 14 extant steam engines are serviceable at any one time,
all
>work at reduced boiler pressure, and time is regularly lost on the
daily
>services. At least the diesels will resore punctuality, assuming they
don't
>break down or collide with any structures. (The DHR's loading gauge is
>restricted by comparison with other Indian 2ft gauge lines, and on an
>earlier trial, an engine DID collide with a station canopy!)
> Railway Board is committed to steam power for tourist trains and
would
>probably be sympathetic to economical forms of steam power. But
platform
>costs are 80% of the expenses of the line, which costs ten times as
much to
>run as it gets in receipts, so let's hear no nonsense about low labour
costs
>meaning that crewing expenses don't matter.
> Cheers
> Ken Walker
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Dipl.-Ing. Nikolaus Sbarounis <sbaros@excite.email
>To: steam_tech@egroups.email <steam_tech@egroups.email
>Date: Wednesday, 12 May 1999 9:27
>Subject: [steam_tech] Fwd: MLRs locos diverted to DHR
>
>
>>Hi, folks!
>>I just got the following e-mail from the Indian Railway newsgroup.
Does it
>>mean partial dieselization of the Darjeeling - Himalaya railway? If it
>>spreads, it may become a disaster for our plans. Below is the report's
URL:
>><A HREF="http://www.expressindia.com/ie/daily/19990512/ige12018.html">http://www.expressindia.com/ie/daily/19990512/ige12018.html</A>
>>Who can check it out?
>>
>>> From: Apurva Bahadur <iti@vsnl.email
>>> To: IRFCA <irfca@cs.email
>>> Subject: MLRs locos diverted to DHR
>>> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 13:24:57 +0530
>>> Message-ID: <373933D1.912C772A@vsnl.email
>>>
>>> Gang !
>>>
>>> There is an article in the Indian Express today which says
>>> that 2 of the 6 new locos (NDM 6 ?) meant for the
>>> MLR have been diverted to the DHR so the MLR is still stuck
>>> with the ageing NDM 1s.
>>>
>>> Apurva
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>________________________________________________
>>Visit my rail website:
>><A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/7209">http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/7209</A>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________________
>>Get your free, private email at <A HREF="http://mail.excite.com/">http://mail.excite.com/</A>
>>
>>----------------------------------------------------------------------
--
>>@Backup - The #1 Online Backup Service
>>Automatic, Safe, Reliable Backup and Restores. FREE for
>>30 Days. INSTALL Now and have a chance to win a Palm Pilot V!
>><A HREF="http://clickhere.egroups.com/click/218">http://clickhere.egroups.com/click/218</A>
>>
>>eGroup home: <A HREF="http://www.eGroups.com/group/steam_tech">http://www.eGroups.com/group/steam_tech</A>
>><A HREF="http://www.eGroups.com">http://www.eGroups.com</A> - Simplifying group communications
>>
>>
>>
>
>

From: Harsh Vardhan <>

Subject: Re: MG link

Date: 15 May 1999 05:30:27 -0500



Before the Gauge Conversion programme came messing around, the 1481 Km
of
Jaipur- Secunderabad by Meenakshi Express was the longest straight MG
run on
IR. Even today it stands tall at 1152 Km between Jaipur-Purna although
the
train is now officially called as simply 9769 Jaipur-Purna Exp. Closely
following Delhi-Ahemedabad Mail through Udaipur at 1019 Km. Third spot
is
taken by Madras-Quilon mail with its 760 Km run through beautiful
territory.

It was absolute lack of imagination on IR's part to destroy this
Deccan-Rajputana link.
Even if was absolutely necessary to connect the 80 Km Purna-Mukhed
stretch
with BG, they could have easily considered a separate BG track(as
between
Jaipur and Ajmer presently) or a gauntleted one to allow both BG and MG
work
through.

During `URS' I have seen in past huge number of people travelling from
Hyderabad to Ajmer by the erstwhile Meenakshi Exp. There used to be no
space even on the roof of this fast train. Wonder what they have taken
to?

Harsh

-----Original Message-----
From: John Lacey <jlacey@zeta.email
To: irfca@cs.email <irfca@cs.email
Date: Friday, May 14, 1999 9:27 PM
Subject: MG link


>Vdate@aol.email wrote:
>>
>> A section of Ajmer-Secundarabad MG track is of historical importance.
Soon
>> after independence, that section was built to connect MG railway
tracks
of
>> South and North India. I can't recall the exact section.
Historians,
please
>> help.
>
>Construction of the Khandwa-Hingoli Rail Link was sanctioned by the
>Railway Board on March 1, 1954 ( various proposals had been considered
>starting in 1882). The enire link was opened to goods traffic on
>November1, 1960.
>>From M.A.Rao Indian Railways ( Delhi 1975) p101-103.
>-John
>
>

From: Harsh Vardhan <>

Subject: Re: sprags is catch sidings

Date: 15 May 1999 05:57:56 -0500




>In case of the Up train, there are three 'catch sidings' which are
tracks
>leading upslope. There is a control cabin, signal and points at these
'catch
>sidings'. Normally the point are set to lead any train up the slope.
Thus a
>train with poor brakepower or a runaway will be switched to the catch
sidings
>where it would be braked by the steep upslope

Apurva,
There is a plate sketch in the `Railways of the Raj' by
Satow
and Desmond which illustrates the accident of the Poona Mail on the
Bhore
Ghat when it ran away due to brake failure. The catch siding and the
earth
buffer failed to arrest her and it crashed on the top of the embankment
killing 14 people. This was of course 1869, very close to the opening of
this line. But are there any new features incorporated in catchment
sidingd
of today to ensure that the heavy trains of today can be arrested during
runaways?

On a similar catchment at Pandhurna between Itarsi and Nagpur, a goods
train
crashed on the top of the embankment(no idea when) forming a horseshoe
shape
presents a great view from the train. Don't know how they brought the
engine
down.

Harsh

From: Shankar <>

Subject: Re: MG link

Date: 15 May 1999 10:30:32 -0500


Hello,
There was one other long (I don't know the actual distance) but not too
well known mg link between Solapur and Bangalore, via Hotgi
Jn-Bijapur-Gadag and all.
Somehow, this line never figured in any news or in any discussions.I
used to see the mg line running parallel to the bg line from Solapur to
Hotgi whenever I travelled to Madras from Poona, and used to wonder
where on earth the line went.
Just like the Meenakshi, there was a very quaintly named train on this
line as well: I think Gol Gumbaj Express or something.
Pity, most of it has now been re-gauged to bg. This train must have
traversed through some of the driest areas of Maharashtra.
The NE regions too must have seen some real long hauls on the mg.
Which is hte longest haul for the ng?
On the 2'0", I think it is Gwalior-Sheopur Kalan.(198 km). What about
the 2'6"? Must have been the Nagpur-Gondia-Nainpur run.
Best regards.
Shankar
Best regards.
Shankar


Harsh Vardhan wrote:
>
> Before the Gauge Conversion programme came messing around, the 1481 Km
of
> Jaipur- Secunderabad by Meenakshi Express was the longest straight MG
run on
> IR. Even today it stands tall at 1152 Km between Jaipur-Purna although
the
> train is now officially called as simply 9769 Jaipur-Purna Exp.
Closely
> following Delhi-Ahemedabad Mail through Udaipur at 1019 Km. Third spot
is
> taken by Madras-Quilon mail with its 760 Km run through beautiful
territory.
>
> It was absolute lack of imagination on IR's part to destroy this
> Deccan-Rajputana link.
> Even if was absolutely necessary to connect the 80 Km Purna-Mukhed
stretch
> with BG, they could have easily considered a separate BG track(as
between
> Jaipur and Ajmer presently) or a gauntleted one to allow both BG and
MG work
> through.
>
> During `URS' I have seen in past huge number of people travelling from
> Hyderabad to Ajmer by the erstwhile Meenakshi Exp. There used to be
no
> space even on the roof of this fast train. Wonder what they have taken
to?
>
> Harsh
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Lacey <jlacey@zeta.email
> To: irfca@cs.email <irfca@cs.email
> Date: Friday, May 14, 1999 9:27 PM
> Subject: MG link
>
> >Vdate@aol.email wrote:
> >>
> >> A section of Ajmer-Secundarabad MG track is of historical
importance.
> Soon
> >> after independence, that section was built to connect MG railway
tracks
> of
> >> South and North India. I can't recall the exact section.
Historians,
> please
> >> help.
> >
> >Construction of the Khandwa-Hingoli Rail Link was sanctioned by the
> >Railway Board on March 1, 1954 ( various proposals had been
considered
> >starting in 1882). The enire link was opened to goods traffic on
> >November1, 1960.
> >>From M.A.Rao Indian Railways ( Delhi 1975) p101-103.
> >-John
> >
> >

From: Bharat Vohra <>

Subject: Re: MG link

Date: 15 May 1999 12:35:42 -0500


Hello all,
as regards the longest MG run...this one has ceased to exist...but it
did
run not so long ago....
the Avadh-Tirhut Mail which used to run from Guwahati in Assam to
Lucknow in
Uttar Pradesh!! An NFR train it was and at a later stage the run got
shortened to Siliguri..was a blue rake if I remember correctly and a
very
popular service to!
Other trains that come to mind that are well over the Madras-Quilon
distance
are all the erstwhile WR MG mainline runs from ADI-DLI, namely- Ashram,
Delhi Mail, Delhi Express and Aravali Express...over 900 Km in distance,
Regards,
Bharat Vohra


______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at <A HREF="http://www.hotmail.com">http://www.hotmail.com</A>

From: Dr. K.J. Walker & Mrs. M.E, Heath <>

Subject: Re: catch sidings, oddities and glories, toy trains, and more

Date: 15 May 1999 18:36:19 -0500


Dear Harsh and everyone,
Omnibus letter! I want to catch up on two or three threads today.
1. Catch sidings. Ideally, I suppose a catch siding should be sized to
safely stop any runaway, however fast. Often, though, there is no space.
Anyone who has seen that photo of the old Bore Ghat reversing station,
with
the siding running up a tall spur to the very top, will appreciate the
kinetic energy those runaways must have possessed. There were several
runaways on the Ghat in the last century; the 1869 one always gets
quoted,
perhaps because it was the first (was it?) and because of that
IIlustrated
London News engraving, but braking and banking were constant
preoccupations
of the G.I.P. well into this century -- and with reason. Harsh, I'm not
at
all sure that they always do retrieve the stock when they have runaways.
Back in 1973, I was travelling on the Arrakonam-Guntakal line, and saw a
spot where a westbound train of hoppers, headed by a diesel (probably a
WDM2, but identification wasn't easy!) had overrun a catch siding -- I
presume following a brake failure -- and burnt out. The remains of the
train
were resting on the embankment that followed the siding -- it dropped
away
quite sharply -- and were in line. They had obviously just been left;
presumably it wasn't worth anyone's while to retrieve them.
2. WP Pacifics. Why on earth would we want to call them oddities?
I
think we need a special category for GLORIES. The WPs certainly were. I
don't think the Railways ever did themselves more good, in terms of
image,
than those engines. They were basically a modern, modestly-proportioned
engine, designed specifically for low-calorie, high ash Indian coal.
Despite
frequent claims by colonialists, they were designed in India, by Railway
Board's then design staff (most of British extraction, it has to be
said).
In fact, the significance of the postwar WP/WG/WL, YP/YG/YL and ZP
designs
was that they broke the colonial mould. The BESA designs of 1903-10 were
orthodox British designs with narrow grates for good-quality coal, many
with
inside cylinders and other common features of the period. The best of
them -- like the HG 2-8-0s -- were the least "British". The 1925
designs,
responding to the work of senior engineers like Coles, had wider grates
and
were more geared to available coal, but perpetuated many of the faults
of
contemporary English design -- and that hurt, as in the case of the XBs,
where the Bihta accident cost over 100 lives. The wartime AWD/CWD/AWC
engines were a real eye-opener -- rugged, simple, accessible, and
reliable,
all the things the British engines weren't. The Indian Railways
engineers
set to and designed a suite of their own engines along the same lines,
and
the postwar "standards" were the result. First-class engines, entirely
suitable for the times. The whole series is a glory, with the WPs the
standard-bearer. I do hope they keep enough of all of them -- they'll be
in
demand.
3. Oddities -- or at least unique items. What about retiring rooms?
Most railways have waiting rooms, but I have never come across sleeping
accomodation as part of the station amenities outside India. (Some
stations
overseas did have attached hotels, of course).
4. Well tanks. These were not uncommon on industrial engines,
especially those built in the 19th century; in fact quite a few Indian
industrials from firms such as Hudson, Orenstein and Koppel, etc.,
have/had
them. What's really unique about the DHR engines is not simply the
combination of saddle and well -- rare enough, it's true -- but the fact
that the saddle tanks are so short that they have been nicknamed "collar
tanks". Also, they were placed well forward so as to keep weight on the
front drivers.
5. Transition couplers were quite common overseas, generally in
the
form of links on the knuckle couplers, although knuckle castings that
fit
over the hook of screw couplings are also not uncommon; in Britain, a
"drophead" coupling that hangs down from the screw hook and can be swung
up
and locked in place is/was in use in passenger stock with Pullman
gangways.
6. Now, for MODELLERS. If you're in HO, there appear to be a
couple
of good possibilities for WDM2s and YDM4s, if you don't mind a bit of
bodging. Firstly, the WDM2 is very similar to the NSW railways' 45
class,
which was made in Australia under license by Goodwin-Alco. There are
some
differences in the external hatch covers, and the cab profile is
different,
but the bogie wheelbase is an exact match. The 45 is available
ready-to-run
in Australia, from AR Kits, at around $A150. ($A1 gets Rs25 and $US0.67
at
present rate of exchange.) The model has a can motor and twelve-wheel
drive;
i.e., modern technology, none of this stone-age English stuff! Secondly,
the
NSW 48 class is very similar to the YDM4, for much the same reasons. It
is
available from Powerline Models, at around $A87. Similar specification
to
the AR model. I don't know how you'd go narrowing it to HOn3.28 (HOm in
Eurpoean notation. Incidentally, this is 11.48mm, but I guess most will
settle for ready-made 12mm gauge track, or 10.5mm HOn3 stuff.) But it
might
be worth a look. Will report. Finally, for anyone bodging a WDM2 and
anxious
to find a suitable underframe/mechanism on the US market, the Atlas
RSD4/5
is nearly right -- the actual wheelbase is out by a couple of scale
inches
at each end. One of the Australian magazines posted a table of
wheelbases
for Australian prototypes two years ago, comparing them with US
mechanisms -- obviously useful, so I'll OCR it and post it on my Web
site,
with the WDM2/YDM4 dimensions added. But give me a couple of days!
7. Martin's and Mcleod's light railways. There were quite a lot
of
these, and the best source is the Railway Board's Indian Railways
Constructed and in Progress, and the compendium History of Defunct
Railways;
there is also a roundup in Hughes n.g. books. Martin's built several
lines
in Bengal, of which the 2ft gauge Howrah-Amta and Howrah-Sheakhala were
best
known. These closed on 1/1/1971. The other Bengal lines were
Bukhtiarpur-Bihar (closed 1962, replaced by BG) and Baraset-Basirhat
(closed
1955), both 2ft 6in gauge. They also had the Shahdara-Saharanpur line,
closed 1970, later replaced by BG. Their last two lines were the
Arrah-Sasaram (closed 1978) and the Futwah-Islampur, closed 1986.
McLeod's
had the Ahmadpur-Katwa and Burdwan-Katwa lines, which were transferred
to
the ER in 1966-7; the Bankura-Damoodar River line, which went to SER in
1967, and the Kalighat-Falta, which was closed in 1955. The other major
private line was Rohtas Industries Dehri-Tiura Pipradih line, the
Dehri-Rohtas Light Railway. This may still be running. There were
numerous
small industrial lines, but these were not common carriers.
8. I think the longest NG run would be Latur Road-Miraj on the
BLR,
which is 250 miles or so. However, no train did it in one hit, as all
services originated from Kurduvadi.
9. Why does Sridhar think the Ooty rack engines "will be phased
out
by 2000"? Certainly they are in appalling shape, but SOMETHING
has to haul trains on the rack, and rack diseasels have an appalling
reliability record. I think Railway Board will have to bite the bullet
and
buy some engines. And I think they'll have to come from SLM.
That's enough for now!
Cheers to all
Ken Walker

-----Original Message-----
From: Harsh Vardhan <champa@del3.email
To: Apurva Bahadur <iti@vsnl.email Roger G. Morris
<roger@buriton.email
Cc: irfca@cs.email <irfca@cs.email
Date: Saturday, 15 May 1999 11:34
Subject: Re: sprags is catch sidings


>
>
>>In case of the Up train, there are three 'catch sidings' which are
tracks
>>leading upslope. There is a control cabin, signal and points at these
>'catch
>>sidings'. Normally the point are set to lead any train up the slope.
Thus
a
>>train with poor brakepower or a runaway will be switched to the catch
>sidings
>>where it would be braked by the steep upslope
>
>Apurva,
> There is a plate sketch in the `Railways of the Raj' by
Satow
>and Desmond which illustrates the accident of the Poona Mail on the
Bhore
>Ghat when it ran away due to brake failure. The catch siding and the
earth
>buffer failed to arrest her and it crashed on the top of the embankment
>killing 14 people. This was of course 1869, very close to the opening
of
>this line. But are there any new features incorporated in catchment
sidingd
>of today to ensure that the heavy trains of today can be arrested
during
>runaways?
>
>On a similar catchment at Pandhurna between Itarsi and Nagpur, a goods
train
>crashed on the top of the embankment(no idea when) forming a horseshoe
shape
>presents a great view from the train. Don't know how they brought the
engine
>down.
>
>Harsh
>
>
>
>

From: Jayant S <>

Subject: Re: MG link

Date: 15 May 1999 20:06:40 -0500


Harsh wrote:
> Before the Gauge Conversion programme came messing around, the 1481 Km
of
> Jaipur- Secunderabad by Meenakshi Express was the longest straight MG
run on
> IR. Even today it stands tall at 1152 Km between Jaipur-Purna although
the
> train is now officially called as simply 9769 Jaipur-Purna Exp.
Closely
> following Delhi-Ahemedabad Mail through Udaipur at 1019 Km. Third spot
is
> taken by Madras-Quilon mail with its 760 Km run through beautiful
territory.

Just wondering: what would have been the distance covered
by the following MG trains when they ran in the 1970s ?
Guwahati-Varanasi Exp
Guwahati(Siliguri ?)-Agra Vaishali Express

--
JS
--

From: Jayant S <>

Subject: Re: MG link

Date: 15 May 1999 20:10:59 -0500



> as regards the longest MG run...this one has ceased to exist...but it
did
> run not so long ago....
> the Avadh-Tirhut Mail which used to run from Guwahati in Assam to
Lucknow in
> Uttar Pradesh!! An NFR train it was and at a later stage the run got
> shortened to Siliguri..was a blue rake if I remember correctly and a
very
> popular service too !

Oh yes, I travelled on this in the days when there was no
direct BG service from NJP to NDLS. The blue rake
looked very smart and distinctive, and the power
was frequently a YELLOW YDM4. What would be the
total kilometer distance ? And did the Vaishali
Express to Agra have a longer run ?

--
JS
--

From: Shankar <>

Subject: Kolhapur-Tirupati Express

Date: 15 May 1999 20:32:57 -0500


Hello,
I've just received (?!!) the Oct.'98 issue of the Indian Railways
magazine, wherein they have mentioned the commencement of a new express
between Kolhapur and Tirupati.
Interesting and unusual train.
Any idea which route this train might take?
The traditional route would have been
Kolhapur-Miraj-Satara-Poona-Daund-Sholapur-Wadi-Guntakal-Renigunta-Tiru-
pati.
However, with extensive re-gauging having been completed in the
Miraj-Hubli area, the route could well be
Kolhapur-Miraj-Hubli-Hospet-Gooty-Renigunta-Tirupati.
Appu, does this train touch Poona at all?
Best regards.
Shankar

From: Jayant S <>

Subject: MG double tracking ?

Date: 15 May 1999 20:45:05 -0500



While on this MG subject, I got to thinking
about MG double tracking: the stretch from
Katihar to Barauni on NER used to have some
MG doubled track. I suppose the electrified
MG line out of Chennai is also doubled.
Are/were there any other sections ?

Was LPG ever carried on MG ? Also, was
Indian MG stock ever fitted with air brakes ?

--
JS
--

From: Sunil Bajpai <>

Subject: Train numbers and which way is Up?

Date: 15 May 1999 22:38:30 -0500


In some postings and in the FAQ we have discussed the 4-digit train
numbering scheme, and the designation of Up and Dn directions.

The 1st digit designates the railway which owns the rake and carries out
the
primary maintenance.

The 2nd digit designates the division that does secondary maintenance.

For superfast trains, first digit is 2 and designates their superfast
status; the second digit, the railway that owns the rake. This
arrangement
avoids having to change the 4-digit train number: 2000 given to the
first
Shatabdi Express by M. R. Scindia, the then Railway Minister!

About the Up and Dn directions I'd like to point out that the
controllers
plot the movement of trains on graphs. On such a graph the x-axis has
time
marked in hourly intervals and the y-axis has station names. Trains that
move up on the graph are Up trains and those that go down are Dn. The
directions are chosen in such a way that neighbouring divisions or
railways
do not have to change the train designation from Up to Dn when the
train crosses boundaries, but it is not always avoidable. We must
remember
that trains are not Up or Down, but rather the direction of traffic over
a
section, and hence Up and Dn tracks on double line sections!

The graphs also allow the controller to plan crossing of trains, which
can
be projected easily by extrapolating the Up and Dn lines.


Sunil

From: Jayant S <>

Subject: Rail Wheel Query

Date: 16 May 1999 00:23:08 -0500


Not directly IR-related:

I was looking at some photos of the
Spanish Talgo wheelsets (www.talgo.com).
It appears that the wheels are not
rigidly connected by axles, but are
mounted on small stub axles individually.

As far as I understand, rigid connection of
the wheels by the axle, along with the
conical tyre profile, is essential to
ensure ideal wheel-rail interaction in
which the profile, rather than the
flange, guides the wheels.

The question is: how, then, are Talgo wheels
really guided on conventional track ?

--
JS
--

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Re: MG double tracking ?

Date: 16 May 1999 07:21:43 -0500


> Was LPG ever carried on MG ? Also, was
> Indian MG stock ever fitted with air brakes ?

I have the same queries. Maybe not LPG but Kerosene, Petrol and other
fuel oils were
carried in very cute MG tanker rakes. If the maximum length of the MG
run is only 1000
Kms as per the thread running currently, it does not make sense to carry
such bulks by
railways.
I do not think there was any air braked MG rakes, by the time the air
braked
revolution began on the BG, the MG was already on the way out.

Apurva

>
>
> --
> JS
> --

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Re: Kolhapur-Tirupati Express

Date: 16 May 1999 09:51:02 -0500


> However, with extensive re-gauging having been completed in the
> Miraj-Hubli area, the route could well be
> Kolhapur-Miraj-Hubli-Hospet-Gooty-Renigunta-Tirupati.
> Appu, does this train touch Poona at all?

No, the KOP - TPTY express does not touch Pune, the Hubli - Hospet -
Guntakal - Gooty
route is correct

Apurva

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Re: sprags is catch sidings

Date: 16 May 1999 10:19:19 -0500


One of the senior ghat drivers (he was a qualified mail/ express driver
but chose to
remain in the ghats for the rest of his driving career - Mumbai division
allows it's
senior drivers such minor liberties) told me this story. He was one of
the few drivers
who had worked every type of loco on the IR, DC electrics, AC electrics,
AC/DC
electrics, Diesels and also Steam in his apprentice days (Pune to Dehu
Road military
special).
Our man was asked to work an air braked BCN special down the ghats from
Lonavala to
Karjat. The ghat driver is required to bank the down train in the
climbing direction
and work heavy goods train in the Up line ghat section as the goods
drivers are
usually inexperienced to handle such difficult loads down steep
gradients.
The BCN rake consisted of three WDM 2s in the lead. The freighter is
checked
thoroughly for brake power at Lonavala yard for brake power and then the
ghat driver
takes charge to work this train upto Karjat yard at the bottom of the
ghats. The rake
left Lonavala yard with satisfactory brake power. But as soon as train
gathered speed
after LNL, the driver found that the brake power was fading. Finally he
managed with
great effort using all the brakes (train/loco and dynamic) managed to
stop the sort of
runway rake just at the middle of the Khandala platform as the train
approached
Khandala catch siding stop signal (the starter signal on the platforms).
It took him
over two Kms to bring the train under control.
Then the locos were heavily wedged and the section controller informed
of the poor
brake power. The driver refused to work this train down the ghats.
After three hours a set of triple coupled WCG 2 bankers arrived from
Lonavala and
towed the rake and the three WDM 2s (now working as bankers) back to LNL
yard.
Naturally the rake was banked with our friend as the banker driver. The
next day the
rake was carefully worked to Daund (where extensive maintenance facility
for air
braked rakes exist in the old steam shed complex) to rectify the problem
of poor brake
power. Once the rake was certified fit, our driver worked the load from
LNL to Kalyan
with the section controller giving the rake a 'one run' from Karjat to
Kalyan stopping
all passenger traffic to let this very late train ahead of everyone.
My friend still shudders at how close his train came to going up the
catch siding that
day.

Apurva


Harsh Vardhan wrote:

> >In case of the Up train, there are three 'catch sidings' which are
tracks
> >leading upslope. There is a control cabin, signal and points at
these
> 'catch
> >sidings'. Normally the point are set to lead any train up the slope.
Thus a
> >train with poor brakepower or a runaway will be switched to the catch
> sidings
> >where it would be braked by the steep upslope
>
> Apurva,
> There is a plate sketch in the `Railways of the Raj' by
Satow
> and Desmond which illustrates the accident of the Poona Mail on the
Bhore
> Ghat when it ran away due to brake failure. The catch siding and the
earth
> buffer failed to arrest her and it crashed on the top of the
embankment
> killing 14 people. This was of course 1869, very close to the opening
of
> this line. But are there any new features incorporated in catchment
sidingd
> of today to ensure that the heavy trains of today can be arrested
during
> runaways?
>
> On a similar catchment at Pandhurna between Itarsi and Nagpur, a goods
train
> crashed on the top of the embankment(no idea when) forming a horseshoe
shape
> presents a great view from the train. Don't know how they brought the
engine
> down.
>
> Harsh

From: Anne Ogborn <>

Subject: electrified NG

Date: 16 May 1999 11:11:52 -0500


Is there any electrified narrow gauge in India?

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