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From: Joydeep Dutta <>

Subject: Re: Questions from a novice and a new comer

Date: 28 Feb 1999 20:17:22 -0500


The WAP4 is also a 5000hp locomotive and is a quiet regular performers
on trains like Tamil Nadu Express, G. T. Express, Coal field Express.,
It is actually the passenger version of WAP7.
Again the 5000hp WAP6 locos which were fitted with Mark 4 fabricated
bogies for running at 160km/h on the WR main line developed some
problems in their wheel trucks are now all transferred to the Asansol
shed of E. Railway from Baroda.They are now restricted to run at
105km/h. Indian railways have the bad habit of showing the people only
the good facts and never really is transparent to talk about its
failures and subsequent trials to improve if any. IR still lacks a
cohesive locomotive operating policy. The railway people will simply
disagree but that is a reality. It appears that when a new class
of locos come the older classes are basically denied maintainence. Just
go and see the maintanenace of the WAM1, WAM2, WAM3, and even the
WAM4 on the E. Railway. They look so badly run down.
More later
Joydeep


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>To: Pradip613@aol.email "irfca@cs.email <irfca@cs.email
>Subject: Re: Questions from a novice and a new comer
>References: <26883ffc.36d9a7ea@aol.email
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>
>> What is the meaning of the term "tout"? I could not discern it from
the e-
>> mails.
>>
>
>A tout is a person who offers to obtain tickets for you instead of you
yourself
>having to queue. But often such persons are dishonest, and may instead
charge inflated price
>or may bribe ticket seller to allow sales only through them.
>They often also will offer you a taxi ride, only to take you to a hotel

where
>you will be charged extra, and a portion kicked back to the tout.
>
>For the whole list - I've a question - how is it these people actually
make
>a living in this way? It would seem that every Indian has long ago
learned not
>to deal with a tout.
>
>> The railway budget talks about WCAM4 with a horse power of 6000. The
previous
>> WCAM3 was the most powerful; I believe at 5000 HP. How does the WCAM4

compare
>> with the most powerful locos in other countries? What is its weight?
In fact
>> it would be nice to record on the Bharat Vohra web page, the weights
of all
>> the locos. I also would like to know the HP of the WP class and other

team
>> locos such as the YG and YP class.
>
>Currently in the US the most powerful locos are 6000HP. These are
shipping only within
>the last few months. The most powerful locos in common use are the 4400

HP.
>
>>
>> What does WCAM actually stand for? Similarly, what does Y stand for
in the YG
>> and YP? Same question with respect to W in WG and WP. I suppose the P

and G
>> are for passenger and goods. Correct me if I am wrong. I thought the
WP stood
>> for Western Pacific but then was confused by WG.
>
>first letter
>W = broad gage Y = meter gage Z = narrow gage
>
>Second letter(s)
>(none) = steam
>D = Diesel
>C = DC electric
>A = AC electric
>CA = AC/DC electric
>
>third letter
>G = goods
>M = mixed
>P = Passenger
>
>following number is design -
>
>So, a WCAM4 is the fourth broad gage AC/DC mixed freight/passenger
service design
>
>
>>
>> The two large "blinders" in front on the steam locos, like you have
on horses
>> eyes, are a distinct feature of many of the Indian steam locos. Can
any one
>> tell me their purpose?
>
>They're smoke lifters. As the train moves forward, air is trapped
between them and
>the boiler. It escapes upwards, creating an updraft that carries the
smoke away from
>the train for the convenience of the passengers. That's why you usually

see them on
>passenger locos.
>


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From: Anne Ogborn <>

Subject: Re: Questions from a novice and a new comer

Date: 28 Feb 1999 23:19:11 -0500


> >They're smoke lifters.

>
> More than passengers, drifting smoke is a nightmare for the loco
drivers. As
> it is the view from the steam locos is not so good, but when the smoke
is
> beating across it is an even difficult situation. Hence smoke
deflectors
> were designed. And there is a good variety of its types, the best
known
> example in India of course is the `Elephant Ears' of YP/YGs.
>
> Harsh

Ah - US practice, interestingly enough, is also to call them elephant
ears.
But, here, I've never seen them on a freight engine.

From: Jayant S <>

Subject: Smoke Deflectors

Date: 01 Mar 1999 00:08:27 -0500



> Ah - US practice, interestingly enough, is also to call them elephant
ears.
> But, here, I've never seen them on a freight engine.
Speed differences ? There were several US passenger locos
which did not have deflectors. Our own WP did not either.

Aerodynamically speaking, I cannot quite figure out how
they worked in the first place, and the elephant-ears
would have further restricted forward vision
through the spectacle plates. Were any other devices
used for smoke deflection anywhere, apart from the
lifting chimney on some Santa Fe 4-8-4 types ?

--
Jayant S
--

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Re: Railway budget highlights contd.!

Date: 01 Mar 1999 00:47:25 -0500


> > Tiruchchirappalli-Dindigul
> Apurva, this wasn't finished 4 years ago. In fact this section was
> closed last August for conversion work. Must have opened recently.

Then which route does the Mumbai - Nagercoil Express take ? It
does not use
the same route taken by the 1081 CSTM - Cape express.

Apurva

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Budget highlights

Date: 01 Mar 1999 00:49:32 -0500


date@aol.email wrote:

> What a treasure! THANKS. It is really exciting to see
wonderful changes
> happening. Only worrisome aspect is 10% increase in the
operating cost. I
> wish they would have hold the line. Two small questions.
> 1. Would JP- Secundarabad train touch Solapur?

Depends on the route it has to take, I think it would not come
via the Manmad -
Daund - Secunderabad route.

> 2. There already a BG as well as MG link between Solapur and
Hootgi. What
> would the railways mean when they talk about the conversion
of that section?

Within this year, the MG line (run by SCR's Hubli division)
will also be
converted to BG. This line is already BG from Hubli side upto
Gadag or Bijapur.

Apurva

From: Jayant S <>

Subject: Re: Smoke Deflectors

Date: 01 Mar 1999 01:18:15 -0500


Apurva Bahadur wrote:
> Jayant S wrote:
> > Aerodynamically speaking, I cannot quite figure out how
> > they worked in the first place
> By promoting laminar airflow near the vertical sides of the boiler ?
I just wondered if it would have been simpler to deflect at the funnel
itself. Of course, the E-ear solution was used all over the world and
would have come about after much experimentation. Anyone know which
loco was the first to have these ? Some European machine ?
> As a vehicle designer, I hope you have noticed the small plates in the
corner of
> the Mitsubishi/Eicher Canter truck's cab.
Yes: they assist in keeping the side windows clear of spray in
wet conditions. Not for the handles, as it is quite simple to
recess those into the door.
> A WG with smoke deflectors would be THE handsomest loco in the world.
So do you
> have a good scan of a WG we can attempt a graft onto ?
I don't, but think we can ask permission to use one
of the couple on the Web that I've seen ? On the unofficial
IR homepage for instance ?

The WG was a supremely majestic loco, in any case !

--
Jayant S :
--

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Re: Smoke Deflectors

Date: 01 Mar 1999 01:26:22 -0500


Jayant S wrote:

> Aerodynamically speaking, I cannot quite figure out how
> they worked in the first place,

By promoting laminar airflow near the vertical sides of the boiler ? The
smoke
will encouraged to not enter this high speed mass of air but go
elsewhere
(hopefully straight up !). Otherwise once the heavy smoke and steam
enters the
turbulent airflow caused by the moving boiler, it would surely find its
way into
the cab. Indian Railways does not care whether the passengers get a shot
of smoke
in their coaches, I find that story a little hard to believe.
As a vehicle designer, I hope you have noticed the small plates in the
corner of
the Mitsubishi/Eicher Canter truck's cab. This is similar to the smoke
deflectors
(plates parallel to the main cab). These (barely noticeable) plates are
in the
same line as the door handles and maybe used to silence the whistle from
the
protruding handles.
A WG with smoke deflectors would be THE handsomest loco in the world. So
do you
have a good scan of a WG we can attempt a graft onto ?

Apurva

> and the elephant-ears
> would have further restricted forward vision
> through the spectacle plates. Were any other devices
> used for smoke deflection anywhere, apart from the
> lifting chimney on some Santa Fe 4-8-4 types ?
>
> --
> Jayant S
> --

From: Jayant S <>

Subject: How to move a loco

Date: 01 Mar 1999 02:08:06 -0500


<A HREF="http://utahdepot.railfan.net/">http://utahdepot.railfan.net/</A>

Check this for an absolutely flabbergasting
recent operation in the US.


-JS

From: Vijay Balasubramanian <>

Subject: Re: Daund-Gangapur Rd. doubling

Date: 01 Mar 1999 07:46:25 -0500


>
>Solapur - Gangapur road doubling is almost complete, Daund - Bhigwan is
also
>complete - these have been sanctioned some time ago. I'll inquire and
let you
>know the exact position of doubling on the Daund - Wadi section.
>
>This is exciting news!! Once Bhigwan-Solapur gets doubled, the entire
>Daund-Wadi section will be a double line. This should drastically
reduce the
>number of crossings and we can expect superfasts from Mumbai towards
>Secunderabad/Chennai/Bangalore.
>
>Vijay
>
>
>

From: Pradip613 <>

Subject: Thanks

Date: 01 Mar 1999 08:39:51 -0500


Received responses from many of you regarding my questions. Several
people
educated me on letters regarding model numbers of locos. Thank you
Thanks to Harsh on telling me that the Anand-Godhra passenger line is
alive
and kicking. He says that it is now hauled by an electric loco. Is it
still
making the 51 KM in 2 hours, like in the past?
After I learned that smoke deflectors are very common, I noticed them on
many
other steam locos of American origin.
Thanks to Shrinivas for the feed back on Konkan trains. We will probably
travel on it in December this year. Should be OK weather wise.
I have met touts. I just did not know that is what they are called!
Best regards to all.

Pradip Rao

From: Shanku Niyogi <>

Subject: Back

Date: 01 Mar 1999 09:48:35 -0500


Hello all,

I'm back from my three week trip of India. During my stay, I got to take
four major train trips - Black Diamond Express from Howrah to Kulti, and
back from Asansol to Howrah, Patna Rajdhani Express from Howrah to New
Delhi, and Poorva Express from New Delhi to Howrah. I was also able to
weasel my way into the shed at Asansol. I've got lots of travelogue
material
and pictures to post in the coming days!

Shanku

From: Shanku Niyogi <>

Subject: Re: Trainspotting

Date: 01 Mar 1999 09:54:15 -0500


I was in NDLS a couple of days earlier, and also spotted the shunter
Indraprastha, which I believe is based there. I got several pictures of
WAP5
locomotives, one of which (I believe, I'll check when I get the pix) may
have been 30000, hauling the Bhubaneswar Raj.

Also saw a WDP1 in Rajdhani livery - took a picture but it may not have
come
out well - there was a policeman eyeing me suspiciously earlier, so I
had to
take it from one of the few spots that don't show up well on Platform
1's
surveillance cameras :).

Took shots of a couple of interesting rakes, including the GT and some
sort
of 50th anniversary rake that had trims in flag colours - can anyone
identify this one?


-----Original Message-----
From: Joydeep Dutta [mailto:joydeepdutta@hotmail.email
Sent: Thursday, February 25, 1999 12:45 AM
To: irfca@cs.email
Cc: iti@vsnl.email
Subject: Trainspotting


Hi! Everybody

This a small note about some train spotting at NDLS(New Delhi) on 23rd
morning and 24th night

23.02.99

Prayagraj Express from Allahabad came in hauled by WAP5 30000, the
prototype WAP5. 4257up Kashi-Viswanath Express entered with WDM2 18748
of Janshi shed in charge. Appeared to be unusual since KV express has
TKD link. Spotted a WDS4 named INDRAPRASTHA
24.02.99
North East Express from Guwahati was drawn in on time by WAP1 22048 of
GZB shed and 2622dn Tamil Nadu was hauled by WAP4 22243 of JHS.
Incidentally WAP4 22242 is named SWARNANJALI. They wre announcing the
arrival of Shane Punjab mail. Is it mail or express. I think its
express.
Bye
Joydeep Dutta

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From: Dheeraj Sanghi <>

Subject: Re: Railway budget highlights!

Date: 01 Mar 1999 10:00:02 -0500




> > Jaipur - Bangalore Express via Secunderabad (Biweekly)
> via Surat-Manmad-Vikarabad?

I would guess that it would be via Ratlam-Bhopal route.
That is the route that Jaipur-Madras Express takes.
I will also guess that they will share the timetable in
the common portion.


> > 2307/2308 Jodhpur-Howrah Express (daily) running via Grand Chord
will
> >run via Main Line one day in a week
> IMHO spoils a good train. Why can't they attach coaches from Patna at

> MGS?

Buying a ticket on this train will become really complicated.
Half the train starts from Bikaner, the other half from Jodhpur.
There was already 2307/2308, 2307A/2308A, and now four more such
numbers will be assigned to this train for its route via Patna.
As if the complication wasn't enough, the AC-2T coach is in Jodhpur
portion, and AC-3T coach is in Bikaner portion. When we went to
Jodhpur, we didn't know this, so we thought that the AC-3T may be
full, and paid considerably more amount for AC-2T. Later we came to
know that we could have got the reservation in AC-3T till Merta Road.


Last week, I travelled on Kanpur-Gonda route. The Kanpur-Lucknow
section already has the electric poles all over. The work is going
at such fast pace that now people are saying that it might be over
by Mar 2000. Some advantages for cities close to PM's constituency,
I guess. Considering that it wasn't even mentioned in budget
last year, and its approval from Cabinet/Planning Commission
came only a few months ago, the progress is really amazing.

Another thing I noted was that all along the Barabanki-Gonda
route, they seem to be preparing for doubling the line. Lot
of earthwork, widening the culverts, etc. I never heard of
doubling of this line. When is it expected to be compeleted.

I hope IR will put on its website information about all ongoing
projects, their status, this year's budget allocation, and the
expected date of completion.

Talking about the railway budget, the minister mentioned the
touts as a problem.
Why are touts a problem. Why should it bother anyone if I pay
someone to stand in line for me. The real problem is not that
someone is standing in line for me. The real problem is that the
clerk on the other side of the window is corrupt. He knows the
touts, and will accept multiple forms from them, etc. Unless
you deal with the corruption inside the organization no number
of anti-tout drives will help.

Someone mentioned that allowing Railway agents access to PRS
will make it even more difficult for a common man to buy
tickets. I don't agree. If one is really worried about these
agents booking tickets in fake names, why not restric them
to book only tickets where the passenger can show a proof of
identity,like it is done for Tatkal service. So the agent also
has to punch in my passport number, or credit card number
or some such information. Those who don't have any such ID
can go to Railway Station and book their ticket there. Infact,
using such IDs, one can even allow booking over the web.

In a long time, we have a budget which is not Delhi-centric.
And there is no new train passing through Kanpur (unless the
train to Darbhanga passes through Kanpur).

I am happy that one of my suggestion (which I made on this list
long time ago, and had written to Railway Board a couple of times,
though I don't know if anyone ever reads my letters there) has
been included in the budget. This is about pricing of tickets.
I always wanted that the ticket price should be a fixed multiple
of some basic fare. Though I don't understand why the sleeper
class is 1.55, and not 1.5 (AC-3T is 1.5 times the Ac chair car,
for example). And when they had introduced sleeper class,
the minister had said that the convenience of sleeper class
is worth 1.25 times that of regular second class. Now how come
the convenience has suddenly become 1.55 times. Does it mean
that sleeper class has improved or second class has become bad :-)
Similarly, I felt that AC-2T should have been more like 6, and
AC 1st class should be 10 times. These two classes are really
becoming very expensive. I hope they won't play around with
these multiplication factors too much, and will increase the basic
fare (second class) in the same proportion from now on.
One class that is missing from the budget announcement is
Executive class (or AC 1st sitting). Do we not have Executive
class in trains other than Shatabdi. That does not seem
right. I think Gomti has AC-1st sitting accomodation. Is
that charged same as AC-1st sleeper or what ?

Will stop here now. More later,

-dheeraj



--------------
Dr. Dheeraj Sanghi (0512) 59-7077/7638
(Off)
Dept. of Computer Science & Engineering (0512) 59-8627 (Res)
Indian Institute of Technology (0512) 59-0725/0413
(Fax)
Kanpur - 208 016 (UP), INDIA. dheeraj@iitk.email
Home Page: <A HREF="http://www.cse.iitk.ac.in/users/dheeraj">http://www.cse.iitk.ac.in/users/dheeraj</A>

From: Vijay Balasubramanian <>

Subject: Re: Railway budget highlights!

Date: 01 Mar 1999 10:14:05 -0500




-----Original Message-----
From: Sankaran Kumar [SMTP:sankaran_kumar@hotmail.email
Sent: Friday, February 26, 1999 8:08 PM
To: irfca@cs.email
Subject: Re: Railway budget highlights!


Hi folks:


> New trains to be introduced :-
>
> Chennai - Tirupati Shatabdi Express
This ought to compete favorably with air traffic between Chennai and
Tirupati. My guess is this Shatabdi will be a success. But how fast?

2nd Shatabdi for AP. A regular intercity express could have done the
job so folks have to pay higher fares unnecessarily. Should have a lone
halt at Renigunta. Will this be a Push Pull train similar to the
Sapthagiri Exp.?


> Shalimar - Haldia Intercity Express
Has SER started running trains from Shalimar or is this the first train?

Seems to me that this is the first express train from Shalimar. Isn't
Shalimar the goods depot for Calcutta? A branch line from Satragachi
goes to Shalimar, right? Uses the newly(?) opened Panskura-Haldia link.


> Mumbai - Sawantwadi - Madgaon Intercity Express
Alas, not a Shatabdi. But why? Tracks not fast enough?

Would probably have a run-time of around 9 hrs. A little too much for a
Shatabdi exp. IMHO, there is not enough time for the same rake to turn
around at Madgaon
and be used for the return trip. Am hoping that its halts are limited
to Dadar, Panvel, Sawantwadi Rd. and Ratnagiri.


> Kurla - Patna Superfast Express (Biweekly)
via Jabalpur, I presume.

Yes. Should be sharing schedules with the Ratnagiri Exp. between Kurla
and Allahabad/Varanasi. Four possible routes:
-via Chheoki-Mirzapur-Mughalsarai
-via Allahabad-Mirzapur-Mughalsarai
-via Allahabad-Janghai-Varanasi-Mughalsarai
-via Allahabad-Madhosingh-Varanasi-Mughalsarai


> Amritsar - Dharbanga Express via Narkatiaganj (Biweekly)
from Gorakhpur to Darbhanga via Narkatiaganj, Sagauli?

The shortest route would be via the newly converted
Gorakhpur-Kaptanganj-Narkatiaganj-Raxaul-Darbangha link. Would this
share schedules with the Jansewa Exp. between Amritsar and Gorakhpur?


> Jaipur - Bangalore Express via Secunderabad (Biweekly)
via Surat-Manmad-Vikarabad?

The shortest route would be via Sawai
Madhopur-Nagda-Bhopal-Nagpur-Kazipet-Secunderabad-Guntakal. Which is
the shorter - Secunderabad-Raichur-Guntakal or
Secunderabad-Dronachellam-Guntakal?


> Guwahati - Chennai Express (Biweekly)
Truncated version of Guwahati-Trivandrum/B'lore train, or one with new
timings? I guess we'll need to wait for the new TT.

Most probably a truncated version of
Guwahati-Trivandrum/Bangalore/Cochin Exp. sharing schedules with this
pack.


> Delhi - Gandhidham Express (Biweekly)
Via Palanpur-Bhildi? Looks like Gujarat MG lines are vanishing fast.

If this shares schedules with the present weekly Delhi-Porbandar exp.
then it would run via Ajmer-Ahmedabad with a reversal at the latter.


> Delhi - Coimbatore Express (Weekly)
Via Gudur, or Secunderabad, or Manmad-Raichur?

Most probably via Gudur as a replacement for the Mangala Exp.


> Run of the following trains to be extended :-
>

> 1555/1556 Guna - Khajuri service to Gwalior
What is the routing? via Bina-Jhansi?

No. Should be employing the newly constructed Khajuri-Panihar link.


> MEMU Services
>
> Jhajha - Kiul section
Looks like MGS-Sitarampur main line is getting electrified.

This confirms that the Sitarampur-Kiul section has been energized as
indicated in the TAAG railway map.


> Bongaon - Petrapole
Any corresponding connection from the Bangladesh side?

Where are these stations located?


> Goalpara - Kamakhaya
What is the difference between this and the Goalpara-Guwahati line?
Kamakhya is the station just before Guwahati towards New Jalpaiguri.

Does Goalpara belong to the Kamakhya-Jogighopa-New Bongaigaon link?


Vijay

From: Vijay Balasubramanian <>

Subject: Re: Trainspotting

Date: 01 Mar 1999 10:53:54 -0500


>
>Took shots of a couple of interesting rakes, including the GT and some
sort
>of 50th anniversary rake that had trims in flag colours - can anyone
>identify this one?
>
>
>Has the GT re-acquired a distinctive livery? If so, I would love to
see your
>picture. Do all the swarnajayanti trains (except the ADI Raj) have
tri-color
>rakes - saffron, white and green?
>
>Vijay

From: Vijay Balasubramanian <>

Subject: Re: Trainspotting

Date: 01 Mar 1999 10:53:54 -0500


>
>Took shots of a couple of interesting rakes, including the GT and some
sort
>of 50th anniversary rake that had trims in flag colours - can anyone
>identify this one?
>
>
>Has the GT re-acquired a distinctive livery? If so, I would love to
see your
>picture. Do all the swarnajayanti trains (except the ADI Raj) have
tri-color
>rakes - saffron, white and green?
>
>Vijay

From: Shanku Niyogi <>

Subject: Re: Railway budget highlights!

Date: 01 Mar 1999 11:41:32 -0500


Some notes:

1. Shalimar is the name of the newest extension to Howrah (it's
technically
a new station, but in reality, it's just a Howrah extension, since it is
so
close to HWH). All SER trains from Howrah will eventually end up in
Shalimar
platforms instead. I think Kharagpur locals may already be using these
platforms.

2. Of all the trains on the new train list, the most criticism I heard
was
of the Patna-Mughalsarai passenger - both cities are already served
quite
well to Mughal Sarai, and this just adds more traffic to a somewhat
loaded
Patna-Gaya section. Maybe after electrification of the line, there will
be
some sort of EMU service running there?

3. The Bangladesh link is very interesting, because there is currently a
bus
route under way (similar to the Delhi-Lahore), travelling from Calcutta
to
Dhaka. The rail link will provide obvious competition, but I'm not sure
if
they can compete adequately, for one major reason. The Benapol/Petropol
border is slow and clumsy. The bus route will avoid it because it will
be
complemented by a new bus terminal in Calcutta, with integrated
immigration/customs services, whereas Sealdah simply cannot provide
these
services as efficiently, and you can't keep people locked in a train
like
you would on a bus. When the Bangladesh link is completed, there will be
passenger trains from Sealdah to Dhaka.
For those who don't know Bongaon, it is the end point of the
northeasterly
suburban line from Sealdah (through Barasat). From Bongaon, there is a
line
to Petrapol, but that line hasn't been used in decades, so that will be
what
is fixed up. There used to be passengers from to Bangladesh on this line
-
old Bradshaws listed trains running to the border. As it has been, this
is
still the preferred public land route to Bangladesh - train to Bongaon
(an
excruciatingly long ride on some of the dirtiest local trains in India),
followed by a bus to the border. The Calcutta-Dhaka bus changes all
that,
and the railways must now improve to keep up.
I also got some information on plans for the rail link through
Bangladesh
all the way through to Singapore - I will post that stuff shortly.

4. I wonder what the Howrah-Jodhpur Express change does to its timings,
now
that it will have to change locos at Asansol and/or Mughal Sarai on one
day?
Most people travelling through Bihar rather than to it prefer the Gaya
line
because it is faster and more scenic.

Shanku

From: Vijay Balasubramanian <>

Subject: Re: Railway budget highlights contd.!

Date: 01 Mar 1999 11:44:13 -0500


>Hi Folks:
>
>Here are some more of my observations:
>New lines...
>
>> Lalitpur to Satna, Rewa-Singrauli and Khajuraho-Mahoba
>Is Mahoba on the Jhansi-Kanpur or the Jhansi-Allahabad line?
>
>Mahoba is on the Jhansi-Manikpur line - between Jhansi and Banda. So
>Khajuraho will have a rail link.
>
>
>> Babupet-Balarshah
>> Solapur-Hotgi
>Are these conversions of MG/NG parallel lines (to BG)? I know of the
>Hubl-Hotgi-Solapur MG line. What line is there between Babupet and
>Ballarshah other than the Wardha-Ballarshah BG line?
>
Conversion of Hotgi-Solapur MG line will effectively make this a
double-line section. I am not aware of any other line between Babupeth
>and Balharshah.
>
>
>> New Lines
>>
>
>> Kovvur-Bhadrachalam Road
>Is Kovvur just south of Rajahmundry across the Godavari? If true this
>line will allow trains going from Vizag to Secunderabad/Mumbai to
bypass
>Vijayawada, since Bhadrachalam Road is connected to Dornakal on the
>Kazipet-Vijayawada line.
>
>
>Kovvur is two stations south of Rajahmudry - after Godavari. This
would
>provide an alternate route between Secunderabad and Rajahmundry via
>Kazipet-Dornakal-Bhadrachalam Rd.-Kovvur. How would it compare in
distance
>to the route via Nadikude-Guntur-Vijayawada?
>
>Vijay

From: Vijay Balasubramanian <>

Subject: Re: Railway budget highlights!

Date: 01 Mar 1999 12:01:58 -0500


>
>2. Of all the trains on the new train list, the most criticism I heard
was
>of the Patna-Mughalsarai passenger - both cities are already served
quite
>well to Mughal Sarai, and this just adds more traffic to a somewhat
loaded
>Patna-Gaya section. Maybe after electrification of the line, there will
be
>some sort of EMU service running there?
>
>Why is that? As far as I know, the only other train that connects the
>Patna-Gaya line with the Gaya-Mughalsarai section is the
Patna-Barkakana
>Palamau Exp. which branches off the Grand Chord at Dehri-on-sone. So
this
>passenger train would be the first direct train between stations on the
>Mughalsarai-Dehri section and stations on the Patna-Gaya section.
>
>
>4. I wonder what the Howrah-Jodhpur Express change does to its timings,
now
>that it will have to change locos at Asansol and/or Mughal Sarai on one
day?
>Most people travelling through Bihar rather than to it prefer the Gaya
line
>because it is faster and more scenic.
>
>I, too, agree with Kumar that this spoils a good run for the present
train.
>IMHO, these two trains would share schedules between Bikaner/Jodhpur
and
>Mughalsarai. The one via Patna would change locos. at Mughalsarai and
arrive
>at Howrah two hours later (around 6.30 am). It would depart from
Howrah
>around 9.30 pm.
>
>Vijay
>

From: Dr. K.J. Walker & Mrs. M.E, Heath <>

Subject: Re: Smoke Deflectors

Date: 01 Mar 1999 15:56:40 -0500


Dear Jayant, Apurva, and all,
I think smoke deflectors were invented in Germany, around the
second
decade of the century, though I'm open to correction. The problem is
that as
loco boilers get larger and start to fill up the loading gauge, chimneys
--
funnels, stacks -- get shorter and they are unable to eject the smoke
effectively. This is made worse by modern front-end design, which
attempts
to increase efficiency by reducing back-pressure at the exhaust orifices
from the cylinders. The result is a slow-moving mass of smoke, which,
especially in damp, humid, or still weather, can cling lovingly about
the
front of the loco and impede vision very seriously. Compare the
smoke-lifting on a DHR "B" class, an inefficient 19th-century design
with a
small boiler and tall funnel, with say a YG or YP, where the boiler
nearly
fills the loading gauge.
The Southern Railway in UK was especailly afflicted with this
problem in the 1920s, and conducted a long series of tests. They didn't
like
the large, square, German deflectors of the time, and tried various
other
expedients (including "wings" round the funnels) before settling on a
rounded, half-height design that was quite attractive. The SR had
simliar
problems with Oliver Bulleid's semi-streamlined "Merchant Navy" and
"West
Country" class Pacifics in the 1940s, and actually conducted wind-tunnel
tests on them.
Smoke deflectors work by trapping the air at the front of the
smokebox, and forcing it up and over, rather than letting it escape
round
the sides. That makes it lift up, and clear the cab. Note that because
the
deflector is thin and edge-on to the driver, it presents quite a small
impediment to vision.
I guess the WPs and WGs didn't need deflectors.
The final German design, incidentally, was a small deflector
about
on the boiler centreline, and only about 1/3 the boiler height. They
looked
very smart indeed, and were adopted on Victorian Railways here in
Australia
as well as in Turkey and parts of Europe outside Germany.
Personally, I prefer my WPs without smoke deflectors!
Cheers from
Ken Walker

-----Original Message-----
From: Jayant S <sank@telco.email
To: IR List <irfca@cs.email
Date: Monday, 1 March 1999 7:35
Subject: Re: Smoke Deflectors


>Apurva Bahadur wrote:
>> Jayant S wrote:
>> > Aerodynamically speaking, I cannot quite figure out how
>> > they worked in the first place
>> By promoting laminar airflow near the vertical sides of the boiler ?
>I just wondered if it would have been simpler to deflect at the funnel
>itself. Of course, the E-ear solution was used all over the world and
>would have come about after much experimentation. Anyone know which
>loco was the first to have these ? Some European machine ?
>> As a vehicle designer, I hope you have noticed the small plates in
the
corner of
>> the Mitsubishi/Eicher Canter truck's cab.
>Yes: they assist in keeping the side windows clear of spray in
>wet conditions. Not for the handles, as it is quite simple to
>recess those into the door.
>> A WG with smoke deflectors would be THE handsomest loco in the world.
So
do you
>> have a good scan of a WG we can attempt a graft onto ?
>I don't, but think we can ask permission to use one
>of the couple on the Web that I've seen ? On the unofficial
>IR homepage for instance ?
>
>The WG was a supremely majestic loco, in any case !
>
>--
>Jayant S :
>--
>

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