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From: Anurag Acharya <>

Subject: Re: Important news

Date: 27 Jan 1999 11:42:24 -0500



>I agree, Annie...I also would vote against any measure that makes it
>*tougher* for people to view the site. The point of the site, as I
>understand it, is not to have a hidden enclave for our group on the
web, but
>to promote the appreciation of the Indian Railways. Thus, it should not
only
>appeal to those already interested in IR (even on our list), but serve
to
>make new people more interested in it. And good, interesting, content
is
>absolutely essential for that.

One way of addressing both concerns would be to ask the contributors
of the messages if they are happy with their messages being put on the
web. For people who have already left the list, this would mean none
of their old messages are put up. Given the recent volume of messages
on the mailing list, I don't think this would be a problem.

>In fact, the idea of the monthly e-zine front page is specifically to
garner
>more interest from newcomers - so that they don't have to wade through
mail
>archives to become interested. And while the primary reason for the
mail
>archives is for members to read up on past messages, it also allows
casual
>readers to "check in" on the list from time to time without forcing
Anurag
>to have to deal with subscribe/unsubscribe requests. Also, the "Send A
>Message" feature will allow someone to send a message (marked as being
from
>a guest) to the list - so that someone who needs to tap the knowledge
of IR
>that exists here can do so without joining the list.

I suggest that sending mail to the mailing list be made a little more
difficult -- at the very least it should require cutting and pasting
an email address (or trying to figure out something is an email
address - mailto tags are particularly dangerous). We have been
extremely fortunate in not being spammed on this mailing list. Many of
the technical mailing lists I belong to are frequently spammed by the
lumpen.

anurag

From: Shanku Niyogi <>

Subject: Re: Important news

Date: 27 Jan 1999 11:56:56 -0500


What we could do is to have the mail go to one of the internal irfca.org
mailboxes, from where someone like myself could read it and forward it
to
the mailing list. One advantage of using a web page for mailing is that
you
don't have to show the email address (it would be hardwired on the
server
side CGI script), so no one can find out where the mail is going.

Shanku

-----Original Message-----
From: Anurag Acharya [mailto:acha@cs.email
Sent: Wednesday, January 27, 1999 11:42 AM
To: Shanku Niyogi
Cc: 'Anne Ogborn'; irfca@cs.email
Subject: Re: Important news



>I agree, Annie...I also would vote against any measure that makes it
>*tougher* for people to view the site. The point of the site, as I
>understand it, is not to have a hidden enclave for our group on the
web,
but
>to promote the appreciation of the Indian Railways. Thus, it should not
only
>appeal to those already interested in IR (even on our list), but serve
to
>make new people more interested in it. And good, interesting, content
is
>absolutely essential for that.

One way of addressing both concerns would be to ask the contributors
of the messages if they are happy with their messages being put on the
web. For people who have already left the list, this would mean none
of their old messages are put up. Given the recent volume of messages
on the mailing list, I don't think this would be a problem.

>In fact, the idea of the monthly e-zine front page is specifically to
garner
>more interest from newcomers - so that they don't have to wade through
mail
>archives to become interested. And while the primary reason for the
mail
>archives is for members to read up on past messages, it also allows
casual
>readers to "check in" on the list from time to time without forcing
Anurag
>to have to deal with subscribe/unsubscribe requests. Also, the "Send A
>Message" feature will allow someone to send a message (marked as being
from
>a guest) to the list - so that someone who needs to tap the knowledge
of IR
>that exists here can do so without joining the list.

I suggest that sending mail to the mailing list be made a little more
difficult -- at the very least it should require cutting and pasting
an email address (or trying to figure out something is an email
address - mailto tags are particularly dangerous). We have been
extremely fortunate in not being spammed on this mailing list. Many of
the technical mailing lists I belong to are frequently spammed by the
lumpen.

anurag

From: Harsh Vardhan <>

Subject: Re: Delhi or Doom?

Date: 27 Jan 1999 23:21:19 -0500




> My 2c worth on the ring railway system in Delhi - I don't think it has
>ever been
> used by the residents of Delhi to get around.

a recent occasion when the might of the ring railway was tested wast the
`India International Trade Fair 98'. NR with some environmental NGOs
operated special trains for this occasion at a frequency of 30 minutes
between Patel Nagar and Pragati Maidan(gate No. 5). the response was
overwhelming but even that did not prevent the choking of Delhi roads on
several days, such is the volume of traffic on Delhi roads.

Most people do not know that a big part of this ring rail system is
actually
a `Goods Avoiding Line'(GAL) and is already saturated with traffic. i
have
lived besides this line and have witnessed upto 300 passes each day in
either direction. However Delhi even now does not have problems like
Bombay
and more lines can be laid if there is a political will. Even a bigger
outer
ring rail link can be thought of.

But who ever has time for the woes of the comman man

Harsh

From: Harsh Vardhan <>

Subject: Re: Backrests in a WDM 2 !!

Date: 27 Jan 1999 23:22:07 -0500


To, Shankar and all,

>Is sleeping on the move really such a serious problem?

Hey! You gotta to be kidding. Perhaps next you'll contend that drinking
is not a serious problem while driving. Most of the skip-signal
collisions/derailments are caused by sleeping -on-the-run, and these
constitute a major part of all accidents. Tell me, would any awake
crew(or
in their right senses) hazard jumping a signal?



>I mean, I understand that there is a 'dead man's pedal' or some such
>device in every diesel or electric engine. If the pedal is not used for
>say a few minutes, the engine automatically starts declerating. Its
like
>keeping the accelerator continuously depressed while driving long
>distance in your car.

Do you feel that Indian crews are foolish enough to let such
contraptions
survive
which interfere with their independence and driving skills? I have not
seen
these things working on most of the mainline locos till date.


>At any rate, most of the electrics and diesels carry a crew of two, so
>its a one in a million chance that both the blokes will doze off at the
>same time.(How cynical or sceptical can one get?:-)


Even one in a million chance is bad enough considering the volume of
trains(and the traffic carried thereupon) on IR. Anyone who's been on
the
footplate of a high speed loco regularly will confirm that it is a tough
job
to continuously gaze at the rails and signals through the loco
windshield(some even don't have that). It is difficult for a gricer on a
footplate out for a thrill and to do it again and again, day after day
and
night after night. Perhaps some music on the footplate will help in
livening
up the spirits.


>I think in most civilized nations all over the world,drivers cabs are
>airconditioned. I think it is the Indian habit of making things as
difficult and
>complicated as possible. Look at the drivers cab of our trucks.There is
>barely an inch of extra space, and the back is absolutely upright with
>a solid wall to lean on.
>


I never said that drivers fall asleep on the run because the are
incompetent, careless and irresponsible blokes. It is without doubt the
toughest job in railway services and with little credit. Goods trains
crews
have a miserable life and I know instances where drivers work for 48
hours
or more at a stretch. There were instances when such overworked goods
drivers were assigned with superfasts(latest was the Karnataka Express
crash
at Faridabad last year) due to shortage of drivers and they rammed them
killing hundreds. Now who is to blame?

I firmly believe that if working conditions of the running staff were to
be
improved, we could have the most enviable track record in the world.

Harsh

From: Anne Ogborn <>

Subject: Re: Backrests in a WDM 2 !!

Date: 28 Jan 1999 00:42:18 -0500


In the US the federal government finally stepped in and
decreed that after 16 hours (later shortened to 12) of continous
work, a crew had to stop the train wherever they were and
couldn't work again for some period (8 hours I think).
Railroaders call this the "hog law" because there's a law
that pigs have to be let out of stock cars and rested after
16 hours of traveling.
I think this law was prompted by a particularly bad collision
caused by a sleeping driver.

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: T.S. Krishna

Date: 28 Jan 1999 02:39:04 -0500


Gang !

This is to announce the sad demise of our fellow railnut T.S.
Krishna in Chennai. Although I had never met him, I would always
look forward to his enthusiastic mails. I shall certainly miss him
and hope that he is in a better place now.

Apurva

From: Balasubramanian, Vijay <>

Subject: Re: T.S. Krishna

Date: 28 Jan 1999 07:29:06 -0500


> This is to announce the sad demise of our fellow railnut T.S.
> Krishna in Chennai. Although I had never met him, I would always
> look forward to his enthusiastic mails. I shall certainly miss him
> and hope that he is in a better place now.
>

This is sad news. Just recently he had posted some stuff on HA
coaches.
Though he has not been on the net for a long time I'll certainly miss
him.
May his soul rest in peace.

Vijay

From: Krishnan Anand <>

Subject: Re: T.S. Krishna

Date: 28 Jan 1999 07:43:33 -0500



Hello all,

> This is to announce the sad demise of our fellow railnut T.S.
> Krishna in Chennai. Although I had never met him, I would always
> look forward to his enthusiastic mails. I shall certainly miss him
> and hope that he is in a better place now.

I guess he was one of the very few who gave inputs on SR and the
activities that go on in recent times. Me being a Chennai crazy guy
would miss all the inputs from Chennai. God bless his family and may his

sould rest in peace. Shanthi Shanthi Shanthi hi.



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From: Balasubramanian, Vijay <>

Subject: Actual arrival times from the CR web page

Date: 28 Jan 1999 10:11:42 -0500


Hi Folks,

It is interesting to observe the delays for Mumbai-bound trains from
various sections (as indicated in
<A HREF="http://www.cr-mumbai.com/arrdepr/index.html)">http://www.cr-mumbai.com/arrdepr/index.html)</A>

As of Jan. 20, at 8.00 pm here are some numbers:

Train Late by

1028 Gorakhpur-Dadar Exp. 6hrs. 40min
1354 Bhusaval-Mumbai Passenger 1hrs. 40min
6530 Bangalore-mumbai Udyan Exp. 45min
2134 Lucknow-Mumbai Pushpak Exp. 10min
2860 Howrah-Mumbai Gitanjali Exp. 30min
2028 Pune-Mumbai Shatabdi Exp. 15min
7308 Kolhapur-Mumbai Koyna Exp. 25min
6340 Nagarcoil-Mumbai Exp. 45min
1022 Pune-Mumbai Indrayani Exp. 15min
1070 Allahabad-Kurla Tulsi Exp. 2hrs. 15min
1072 Varanasi-Kurla Kamayani Exp. 2hrs. 55min
5648 Guwahati-Dadar Exp. 5hrs. 25min
2617 Mangala-Lakshadweep Exp. 3hrs. 15min
-Trains from the Allahabad-Itarsi section are the worst hit followed by
KR
and Wadi-Pune. Why are Pune-Mumbai trains getting delayed? Sloppy
performance by CR!
-The Gitanjali is late by 30 mts. despite an overdose of recovery times.
Pushpak has done reasonably well, thanks to the recovery times in the
Itarsi-Bhusaval-Igatpuri section.
Vijay

From: Balasubramanian, Vijay <>

Subject: News from Indian Express

Date: 28 Jan 1999 10:31:49 -0500


MRVC to be set up in two months
EXPRESS NEWS SERVICE

MUMBAI, JAN 25: Minister of State for Railways Ram Naik today stated
that
the Mumbai Rail Vikas Corporation, approved by the Union cabinet a
fortnight
ago, would be set up by March 31.
Speaking to reporters after a meet held to discuss the `Progress of the
Mumbai Suburban System in the last 10 months,' Naik stated that the
memorandum and articles of the association, its registration would be
approved soon and a board of directors set up soon after.
These are the last few steps before the MRVC can finally embark on its
task
of implementing the Rs 4741 crore project under the Mumbai Urban
Transport
Project (MUTP-II) over the next five years.
Headed by a Chairman who will be a senior railway official, the MRVC is
to
be governed by a 11-member board of directors including six
representatives
from the railways, three from the state government and two NGOs.
The budgetary provision in 1998-99 for major suburban projects had
already
been increased from Rs 66.47 crore last year to Rs 159.34 crore from Rs
66.47crore. A further increase could be expected in these funds in the
railway budget that would be presented on February 25.
The minister once again struck down the possibility of having an
underground
metro rail in the city, a feasibility study of which is being undertaken
by
the Maharashtra State Road Development Corporation (MSRDC). ``A metro in
Mumbai is not economically and financially feasible,'' he said. Such
projects proved to be capital intensive and non-remunerative. When there
was
enough land available on the surface, it was a waste of meagre resources
to
go underground, he said.
Naik said that talks for funding half the rail component of the Rs 4741
crore MUTP-II were in their final stages with the World Bank. However,
if
the bank did not finance the project then the expenses would be shared
between the Railways and the state government.
He said the Railways had the responsibility of completing several
ongoing
projects. It had now been decided to prioritise projects which could be
completedearly and which would be remunerative. Projects like those in
the
North-East and Kashmir were unremunerative but `socially desirable' and
hence a 15 per cent allocation was being made for them in the Ninth Five
Year Plan.
The Railways needed a whopping Rs 39,000 crore to complete all the
unfinished projects all over the country whereas it had an allocation of
just Rs 9,000 crore in the current Five Year plan.
Today's meet which basically showcased Naik's achievements as the
minister
of state for railways in the last 10 months was attended by Chairman of
the
Legislative Council N S Pharande, senior BJP leader Jaywantiben Mehta,
MLA
Kirit Somaiya, Western Railway General Manager V D Gupta and Central
Railway
General Manager K B Shankaran.
Referring to the recent controversy over the renaming of Kurla terminus
after Lokmanya Tilak, the minister termed it as an `unfortunate debate'.

Speakers showered praise on Naik for speedy implementation of various
projects including cabinet approval for MRVC,extension of suburban
services
to Panvel and installation of more computerised season ticket windows
and
ticket vending machines.
On Sunday, Naik inaugurated the eighth computerised reservation centre
on
the Mumbai suburban section of the Western Railway at Vasai Road railway
station.
The reservation centre, built at a cost of Rs 38.82 lakh, also includes
two
new counters for issuing computerised season tickets for any station on
the
suburban sections of Western and Central Railway.
Naik said new computerised passenger reservation centres would be opened
shortly at Malad, Bandra Terminus, Palghar and Dadar railway stations.
Copyright © 1999 Indian Express Newspapers (Bombay) Ltd.

From: Shankar <>

Subject: [Fwd: Re: T.S. Krishna

Date: 28 Jan 1999 11:06:48 -0500


Hello,
The passing away of anyone is always a sad event, more so if he is a
railnut.
I pray that the departed soul may rest in peace.
Best regards.
Shankar


This is to announce the sad demise of our fellow railnut T.S.
Krishna in Chennai. Although I had never met him, I would always
look forward to his enthusiastic mails. I shall certainly miss him
and hope that he is in a better place now.

Apurva

From: SHRINIVAS V. JOSHI <>

Subject: Trial KR Freights!!

Date: 29 Jan 1999 01:04:53 -0500



Hi!

Report in TOI dt 29th Jan 99
----------------------------
Update on Ro-Ro Service on Konkan Rly .Sector---->>>>>
----------------------------
Trial run was conducted on 26th & it was ahead of schedule. Charges
Rs:4300/-
for loaded truck, it will save 734 KMS of road travel. Can carry 60 ,10
tonner trucks at a time in each South & North direction. This service is
thrice a week. It is sure to save diesel, less of wear/tear of tyres &
other
spares who make use of this service.

Bravo KR management!!

Shrinivas

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Re: Actual arrival times from the CR web page

Date: 29 Jan 1999 01:20:04 -0500





> -Trains from the Allahabad-Itarsi section are the worst hit followed
by KR
> and Wadi-Pune. Why are Pune-Mumbai trains getting delayed? Sloppy
> performance by CR!

There are no better words to describe the CR. I won't be surprised if
the Wadi
- Pune trains actually get delayed between Pune and Mumbai. During my
recent
trip to Wankaner, I found that the WR dazzles in efficiency while even
Deccan
Queen and Pragati were both 30 minutes to 45 minutes late. The culprit
is the
numerous caution orders and slowdowns due to track maintenance work. I
have
seen track maintenance work on for the last 10 years ! How the WR
manages
their schedules inspite of heavy loads to their tracks is to be studied.
The
answer lies in lack of the ghat section and of hutments near the tracks
on the
WR. Also the traveling public is better disciplined on the WR.
The CR webpage has more real info than the WR page and the route maps
and
delayed arrival/ departure makes compulsive viewing.

> -The Gitanjali is late by 30 mts. despite an overdose of recovery
times.
> Pushpak has done reasonably well, thanks to the recovery times in the
> Itarsi-Bhusaval-Igatpuri section.
> Vijay

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Formation of Pune division

Date: 29 Jan 1999 01:46:30 -0500


Gang !

As per a news item today, the Pune division's jurisdiction is being
defined. Although we had this division from 1995 (read from
Kalmadi's times !) the work of the PA division was never clear. Even
the CR tt list Pune division without defining their limits. So Pune
division is Lonavala - Pune - Daund - Baramati and Pune - Miraj -
Kolhapur.
The control centre of the PA division is being housed in a sparkling
new two storied building which would come up near the platform no 6.
Rs. 10 crores has been sanctioned for that purpose already.
I think Hubli division would be glad to get rid of the PA - MRJ -
KOP line, it makes heavy losses and is really a branch line rather
than a trunk. But will Solapur division take the snatching of Daund
and Baramati lying down ? However the profit centres of Cement
traffic from Shahbad and the sugar traffic near Ahmednagar is still
with SUR division.
I can foresee that the 1.5 KVDC line would be stretched to Daund
(which will become a suburb of Pune after that). As closed Daund
steam shed is really used for maintaining air braked freight rakes,
that land could house a AC loco shed and we would have 25 KV OHE
from DD to Guntakal within the next 20 years. But then doubling
work comes first within the next five years of so. Also by then
Guntakal would come under the wires from Renigunta side. I have
heard some reports that the masts have already been up from
Renigunta to Cuduppah, so Guntakal is not all that far away.

Apurva

From: Balasubramanian, Vijay <>

Subject: Need index page for my images

Date: 29 Jan 1999 06:47:27 -0500


Hi Folks,

Is it possible some someone to host a web-page with indices to my
pages of
IR travel photos? It would have links to my 5 pages and also my present
email address. The current information at my home page is outdated
since I
am no longer at Xavier University.

Thanks in advance,
Vijay

P.S. If this an expensive affair, forget it!!

From: Rajan Mathew <>

Subject: Re: Actual arrival times from the CR web page

Date: 29 Jan 1999 11:10:05 -0500


FLASH

The 0111 up Konkan Railway Mumbai CST - Madgaon Express is renamed
Konkan
Kanya Express

Rajan

----Original Message-----
From: Apurva Bahadur <iti@vsnl.email
To: Balasubramanian, Vijay <vbalasubramanian@noblestar.email
Cc: irfca@cs.email <irfca@cs.email pushkar_apte@hotmail.email
<pushkar_apte@hotmail.email
Date: Friday, January 29, 1999 3:23 PM
Subject: Re: Actual arrival times from the CR web page


>
>
>
>> -Trains from the Allahabad-Itarsi section are the worst hit followed
by
KR
>> and Wadi-Pune. Why are Pune-Mumbai trains getting delayed? Sloppy
>> performance by CR!
>
>There are no better words to describe the CR. I won't be surprised if
the
Wadi
>- Pune trains actually get delayed between Pune and Mumbai. During my
recent
>trip to Wankaner, I found that the WR dazzles in efficiency while even
Deccan
>Queen and Pragati were both 30 minutes to 45 minutes late. The culprit
is
the
>numerous caution orders and slowdowns due to track maintenance work. I
have
>seen track maintenance work on for the last 10 years ! How the WR
manages
>their schedules inspite of heavy loads to their tracks is to be
studied.
The
>answer lies in lack of the ghat section and of hutments near the tracks
on
the
>WR. Also the traveling public is better disciplined on the WR.
>The CR webpage has more real info than the WR page and the route maps
and
>delayed arrival/ departure makes compulsive viewing.
>
>> -The Gitanjali is late by 30 mts. despite an overdose of recovery
times.
>> Pushpak has done reasonably well, thanks to the recovery times in the
>> Itarsi-Bhusaval-Igatpuri section.
>> Vijay
>
>
>
>
>

From: Rajan Mathew <>

Subject: Re: T.S. Krishna

Date: 29 Jan 1999 12:35:28 -0500


Its very sad to hear of this loss. Krishna will be missed by all of us
for
the enthusiasm displayed as evident in his mails. Going through my
archives,
I did find his sketch of Chennai interesting. Maybe we could hoist it in
his
memory on the IRFCA site.

Rajan

From: Steven Brown <>

Subject: Re: Need index page for my images

Date: 29 Jan 1999 18:09:19 -0500


No Problem! Since I already have links to your 5 pages of photos and
also
your info/links page alll that is needed is a new page to replace the
outdated info... ...just E-mail me the details or replacement page
and
I'll put it up.

Likewise If anyone else has some content or index pages or anything
similar
please send me info I can add your content with credits to you at no
cost to
any of us.

Steve

The First Indian Railways Homepage( unofficial)
<A HREF="http://www.trainweb.com/indiarail">http://www.trainweb.com/indiarail</A>

is also The first unofficial IRFCA Page
<A HREF="http://www.trainweb.com/indiarail/irfca.htm">http://www.trainweb.com/indiarail/irfca.htm</A>

-----Original Message-----
From: Balasubramanian, Vijay <vbalasubramanian@noblestar.email
To: irfca@cs.email <irfca@cs.email
Date: Friday, January 29, 1999 6:49 AM
Subject: Need index page for my images


>Hi Folks,
>
> Is it possible some someone to host a web-page with indices to my
pages
of
>IR travel photos? It would have links to my 5 pages and also my
present
>email address. The current information at my home page is outdated
since I
>am no longer at Xavier University.
>
>Thanks in advance,
>Vijay
>
>P.S. If this an expensive affair, forget it!!
>

From: Apurva Bahadur <>

Subject: Our own webpage

Date: 30 Jan 1999 01:19:27 -0500


Gang !

I take pleasure in announcing our own permanent home on the net.
Please go to:
<A HREF="http://www.irfca.org/site.html">http://www.irfca.org/site.html</A>
This will enable us to a presence on the net. We would also be
easily found to anyone searching for Indian Railway related
material.
Shanku Niyogi <shankun@microsoft.email has taken the initiative in
the creation of such a site. Please note today the site is only a
skeleton (a beautiful skeleton nevertheless :-)) without much
contents. That is where all of you come in. Please let us all have
your comments and give your inputs to fill this site up. We owe it
to the great Indian Railways.

Apurva

From: Sachin P Keshavan <>

Subject: Re: Our own webpage

Date: 30 Jan 1999 20:46:42 -0500


Gang,
This is just a wonderful page. Let the Indian Railways be known world
wide.

Bye,
Sachin.
*******************************************
Sachin P Keshavan,
E mail: sachin_pk@hotmail.email
Pager: 9624 - 285433
Phone: +91 - 80- 3314500
Home page: <A HREF="http://209.67.19.99/~sachin_pk">http://209.67.19.99/~sachin_pk</A>
-------------------------------------------
When everything seems lost,
Remember, future remains .....
*******************************************




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